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tv   The Big Picture With Thom Hartmann  RT  September 2, 2013 7:00pm-8:01pm EDT

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the day. german intelligence shares obama's confidence the assad regime was behind last month's alleged chemical attack in syria as washington continues building the case for a military strike meanwhile in the u.k. . revelations that have british company with quantity lights and takes all potential not gas a chance that the government has a think tough questions about how that was allowed to happen. ousted egyptian president morsi will stand trial for inciting violence and the murder of protesters amid accusations from his supporters of the case is politically motivated.
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have you with us here on r.t. our top story a german intelligence agencies reportedly sided with the white house in blaming the assad regime for the alleged chemical attack in syria last month but like their u.s. counterparts germany's spies have failed to provide hard evidence he tells from artie's peter all over in berlin what we've seen reported is that the head of the german security services held a meeting with top brass within the main political movers and shakers to talk about what intelligence germany had regarding chemical attacks on syria and they say that it was a news. they base this on interceptions mase on doctors who have treated patients and they cite that the symptoms that those patients had. similar to those that you would find of somebody who had being the victim of a sarin gas attack what is interesting from this one is one bit of information
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that's come out regarding a intercepted telephone call reported. between one senior hezbollah and somebody at the iranian embassy now according to the intercept it says that it's the the hezbollah or official it said. lost his nerve and made a huge mistake by ordering this attack on the german is playing a fine balancing act between keeping their american allies happy by by showing support and not direction but also by trying to keep the german people happy we have an election coming up here in just a few weeks time and opinion inside germany has been predominantly anti involvement in the syrian conflict this balancing act is something that the german government haven't played all too well on every occasion just last week we saw the the foreign minister yukito vest of now he issued a statement through the foreign ministry in english in which he said germany will be among those calling for action to be taken well that statement lasted one hour
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before a retraction was given they cited the fact that it was it was muddled in translation in a far more watered down version of the germany stance was given which was called the sequences only in the right type of scenario so germany and angela merkel indeed is playing a very very interesting balancing game between keeping her allies happy and keeping the german electorate happy of course ahead of that general election in just a few weeks' time a german journalist man walks in writer also says germany hard services are actively working to support the allegations of the u.s. surveillance programs. the us americans are starving for credibility and for this the german and i especially germany and the german secret service turned out to specially during the last weeks by this huge and it's a scandal to be type of branch of the us intelligence so it looks like the us
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intelligence and the german intelligence delivered and this just in time much more a little chunk area now are being flown credibility in the syria case so they have the problems that not to even know their own population of even their own political class believing in this what is called evidence by the it was summarily can see the same in europe the general opinion is strongly critical against those allegations of chemical warfare by president assad in syria. you know the geisha is coming from berlin rely on the same kind of conclusions that were presented by the white house as it tries to win congressional and public support for a strike on syria let's take a closer look at how the case has been built so far u.s. officials have cited unconfirmed evidence also pointing out amateur footage being posted on you tube and other online sites citing an attack accounts by people who
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say they saw what happened also being used to build the case against the syrian government latest claims from the state department revolve around alleged samples taken from the war zone that they say confirm the use of chemical weapons but the u.n. investigation has been completed yet and the world body says it's the only one who can determine credible evidence of a chemical attack. addressed students at moscow state university of foreign relations today being the first day of class he started off with some broad general statements about the western position on the middle east saying that the policies are inconsistent and that there are double standards that exist but specifically speaking to the idea of the united states having evidence saying that it was the assad regime that used chemical weapons inside syria he said that it just does not pan out in fact he said there's no concrete evidence no locations were given no names were given no specifics of any kind and listen to his own words about what he had to say as we believe we've seen these papers there is no evidence it's just
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accusations if you have read any super secret data well you need to remove the secrecy because we're talking about war and peace now the big news also is that lavrov talked about the situation in march back in aleppo where the russia believed that it was the syrian rebels that use chemical weapons and pointing to evidence that russian. experts had looked at saying that the ordinance that were used were not manufactured by any professional company the gas that was used was also not done on a professional grade suggesting that it was the rebels that used chemical weapons at that point in time then russia wanted a u.n. investigation but it seemed to what he says his western partners on the u.n. security council didn't seem interested in investigating back then in march. moscow has criticized the u.s. for its quote inappropriate game of secrecy over the alleged chemical attack near damascus as the u.s. has been refusing to reveal the full evidence it claims to possess russian
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lawmakers suggested launching dialogue with their u.s. counterparts artie's john thomas has more on that reaction from the russian leadership. well nato has again said it's not going to take part in a possible military action against the syrian government meanwhile the u.s. navy is continuing to step up its presence in the region ahead of a congressional vote on the issue five u.s. destroyers loaded with missiles along with an amphibious assault craft in the mediterranean they've been joined by an aircraft carrier group now in the red sea to support the attack on syria if ordered the carrier u.s.s. nimitz one of the largest ships in the world of the more than three hundred metres long is powered by nuclear reactors and has ninety planes and helicopters aboard accompanied by five smaller craft armed with cruise missiles meanwhile images have emerged on social media purporting to show u.s. servicemen speaking out against a looming strike against damascus people in military dress are seen posing in front of cameras with signs saying that they didn't sign up to fight with al qaeda in
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syria these pictures cannot be verified the pentagon is reportedly looking into the possible identities of those involved for some perspective on that i'm joined by gordon duff a marine corps veteran and editor of the independent news website veterans today thanks for joining us so how likely do you think it is that these images portray people who genuinely serve in the u.s. military. well since we have. somewhere between the polls estimate fifty to seventy percent of americans are clearly opposed to up. against syria and members of the military. particularly lost five thousand killed fighting the same groups in iraq that we are advocating that we support in syria so members of the military from either side and there are clear divisions in the military both the left and the right none of them have any reason to want to support syrian rebels as for those people we're seeing the i have no we're verification than you do the uniforms
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and medals look good gentlemen we hear a lot of feeling about this from the military and there have been some very strong opinions from the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff general martin dempsey that he is strongly opposed toward military action in syria as a former marine yourself can you gauge the mood for us about the military personnel and what they're saying about the potential intervention in syria if you have any sense of that. by this time thirteen years of war. people in the military have no faith in anything the government has to say at all they're sick and tired of the war and. the government has no credibility with the rank and file in the military and what do you make of the fact that washington is backing syrian rebels who are fighting alongside militant groups some of them linked to al qaeda. you know it's something that we are noticing every single day
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we look at washington and we're finding that washington especially the favorites by secretary kerry are increasingly divorced from reality when we see the blood in it meets with president obama and that senators mccain and senators. graham invited to the white house to visit a president that they have long criticized and even hate. we call this a problem this problem strange bedfellows and this is what this is has brought about its best rates president obama says he wants a narrow and limited action oh if the u.s. goes ahead is there a danger do you think of mission creep you know brzezinski was talking about that today that the idea of a limited action will make the u.s. look weak a major reaction will be stick it belies afghanistan and put a she hightest anti-american government in place president obama has got himself
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painted into a corner there is no way out mission creep is that is in the cards exactly as you predict the u.s. is continuing to boost its military presence near syria do you think that indicates that among lawmakers there may be a desire for an intervention well among lawmakers in particular rand paul on the republican side a senator with tremendous backing in the tea party has called the the. attack in syria a false flag on the democratic side alan grayson highly influential and certainly a major player in the pact lobby has said exactly the same thing even hillary waxman has as come out so the president's support on either side of the aisle is very weak. gordon duff a marine corps veteran editor of the independent news website veterans today thanks for your time you. can reveal the british government rubber stamp the export of
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chemicals that could be used to prepare the nerve agent sarin it's the same substance that's at the center of the alleged toxic gas attack last month near damascus licenses to sell the chemicals granted to a huge base u.k. based company although they were never actually delivered to their intended destination here's what the u.k. the department of business skills and innovation told us about this they say the british firm was given the export license only after claiming the substances were going to be used for civilian purposes not clear exactly who was intended to receive the shipments nor the name of the company that was set to send that marty sara firth has more. business secretary vince cable certainly going to be facing some tough questions over these revelations that the british government has granted export licenses as yet as yet unnamed british company now this is for substances to be sent to syria and it was due to so-called chilled use substances
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and that was potassium and sodium fluoride in both these agents to be used as precursor chemicals in the manufacture of nerve gas nerve those export licenses granted by the department for business innovation and skills it's reported in january the seventeenth and eighteenth and that lightens valid for six months in two thousand and twelve when the civil war in syria was already raging but he's concerned anyway again about these suspected chemical weapons stockpiles a map of some of the suspected sites there of course huge concern about what the syrian government could potentially be doing with those chemical weapons but of course also that some of those sites could fall into the wrong hands if the situation gets ever more complex there are going to be questions tabled in parliament to really runs through and scrutinize exactly how these licenses for chemical agents that could be used in the types of weapons that the syrian
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government are being accused of using on their own people who granted. you can always click on our t. dot com for the latest updates analysis and social media reaction as well as all reports on the developing story. later in the program a thousand days in the life of juliana songe we'll look back at what the wiki leaks founder has been through as well as a possible prospects for his future plus. i mean you have. your report on why financial concerns are forcing the city of lights to start teaching the notoriously averred persian service sector workers the rules of tourist etiquette after a short break. going on and on the obama administration's continued insistence that the syrian regime must be punished for alleged use of chemical weapons has convinced few of washington's traditional iowans the americans have said they will strike syria on
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their own if they have to what does this say about america's standing in the middle east in the future of international law. choose your language. of holy week you know if you're going to. choose the consensus you. choose you have to use that to be great to. choose the stories that in life choose me access to. technology innovation all the developments around russia. as you have heard.
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quarter past the hour now egypt's ousted president mohamed morsi will stand trial for inciting violence and murder along with more than a dozen other muslim brotherhood members charges relating to a december protest at the presidential palace in cairo that left seven demonstrators dead the country's army back government has set up a power to revise egypt's constitution with a brotherhood store fusing to take part in the new government supporters of the ex-president pressing ahead with rallies calling for his return to power despite hundreds having died in violence. from the pro morsi british egyptians for democracy believes the charges against the former leader aren't justified. president morsi is the first ever elected president of egypt charged with these crimes it's very obvious that what we're seeing is a very politically motivated charge he was elected by everyone in egypt at the end of the day this is how democracy what people go to the ballot box they choose somebody and this person stays there for their turn his time was four years
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so he spent one year for people to remove him they have to go back to the ballot box not through the masses not through people on the ground what we've seen is a very wealthiest and this is a text. is illegitimate who is always something illegal you cannot accept a crew in twenty thirteen and more what we're seeing now is very obvious and it's very clear and what the people in the streets that millions of egyptians now are doing on the streets of egypt they say they will never go back to the time of their own never go back to dictatorship they will carry on peacefully resisting this military coup more stories at our website team has lined up for you online right now high level espionage a report on how even countries normally allies of the u.s. become part of n.s.a. spying plus. these folks from el salvador know how to play with fire head to the emotion section of r.t.
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dot com for the fall claiming video. a short spell in a london jail followed by house arrest now trapped in ecuador's u.k. embassy that's how wiki leaks founder julian assange has spent the last thousand days here's your dish ordeal started in two thousand and ten when he left sweden for authorities wanted to question him over allegations of sex crimes after an unsuccessful attempt to appeal his extradition from the u.k. back to stockholm asylum sought refuge in the ecuadorian embassy in london he's now spent more than a year holed up inside the diplomatic mission because he faces immediate arrest the second he sets foot on british soil the former hacker could also face. it is in the u.s. because a site revealed so much information about the country's military operations we could be exposed and christina raff insane tells us that given the u.s. added to toward some whistleblowers the prospects for assad are promising. it is quite all abuse if you read through the transcript of the trial against chelsea manning and see what kind of arguments were raised there and how often we can use
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was in that mentioned in the trial that there is a very strong possibility that the next target is to innocence and it might already be an indictment against him and all the others in our organization we see as well the escalating war against to those who commit the act of journalism and this is escalating for month to month the argument is this is the bradley manning was the first whistle blower and he was history who has been. prosecuted and found guilty on the basis of us journalists will come next it could possibly be we could leaks all the media organizations it's a real possibility and we nor ball do on investigation in the u.s. into we could leave which has been now going on for three years and probably cost. quite a sum of money because it has been. one of the biggest criminal investigation
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in la times in the u.s. so it is a very worrying situation turning now to some other stories making headlines across the globe matic footage emerging showing tornadoes tearing through eastern japan around sixty three people hurt one hundred homes damaged lightning strikes also cut power to tens of thousands of households officials warn the public over the worsening weather conditions. three insurgents died in an assault on a us military base in eastern afghanistan before the attack they torched several nato trucks but failed to enter the base after a gun fight broke out no u.s. or afghan soldiers were wounded but it cost further doubt on the country's stability added the official nato pullout in two thousand and fourteen. violent clashes broke out during protests against the president in mexico's capital hundreds of all the police and seven days of mass demonstrations came to a close and reeking nieto is only a year into his presidential term but he's already angered the public by proposing
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to privatized the country's oil production. hundreds of members and supporters of the newly founded alternative for germany party gathered in the streets of dusseldorf for an election rally marchers held posters and banners critical of and demanding the return of the deutschemark the a.f.p. was founded in february twenty third team known for its conservative views and its famous for being adamantly anti euro and advocating the idea of separate currencies being used for europe. finally in this news block a lock of civility demonstrated by some service sector workers in paris has become such a problem that officials have been forced to act on a mission to teach etiquette to french workers because of fears the country could be losing out on millions of euros amid a continent wide debt crisis. reports. are. going to go up are you. smiling faces the belie a troubled economy with the number of job seekers rising to three point twenty eight million in july from the twenty seventh month in a row and
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a budget deficit the government can barely rein in france has been walking on eggshells since europe's economic crisis hit but there is a small respite visiting the street dangers of momart in paris is the last for any tourist in the city francis clench a title of world's top destination in two thousand and twelve with eighty three million visitors at thirty three million in paris alone but the numbers may not be enough as the reality is not always up to par with the dream. of the city of like known as much for its beauty as its unfriendliness at the extreme end of it a few years ago dozens of japanese tourists were reported to have been struck with the so-called paris syndrome they were so madly affected by rude encounters that they had to be repatriated back to japan and the state of shock. paris is beautiful it's wonderful but the reason siamak and they have to change things because they're running revenue from. america and other people that they're rude but i haven't had
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any reading counters myself i'm shocked at the behavior of some people who are supposed to be tourism professionals i won't get into details but really i'm shocked at the attitude is given me. with tourism making up more than seven percent of the french gross domestic product tourist officials in the country's capital decided to attempt the naysayers claim is impossible giving those who work in the service industry to be more pleasant. again beam was launched this summer in paris called do you speak to it's a guide for restaurateurs taxi drivers and shopkeepers on how to behave towards their city's guests giving them country by country advice on what is expected from them. it is important for everyone involved in economy to treat better regardless of their nationality in order to make them want to come back and to spend move forward on this or that and that's precisely where france
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lags behind the competition despite being the number one destination the un world tourism organization and found out that visitors to the u.s. spend twice as much as those who travel to france and fewer people making the journey to the states that the loss of revenue is proving twice as costly as europe continues to struggle with a debt crisis that seriously endangering the french economy this paris taxi driver insists though that while the dream you speak tourist is a good idea creating a positive experience is not a one way street. first of all for us taxi drivers that are passengers who are very excuse me for saying so annoying. something they may simply have to accept with a smile they want to hold on to one of its economic i mean this move losing hands but it's important to remember the good manners costs nothing. learning bad manners may be very pricey indeed. does or sylvia r.t.
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paris. coming up cross talk with peter lavelle stay with us here on our. many gay bars are starting to refuse to sell russian vodka as a means of protesting the homosexual propaganda laws in russia as i've said before boycotts are a great way to put pressure on people but are they putting pressure on the right people not only is it racist to assume that hurting the vodka flow will deal a massive blow to the russian economy but it is also racist to think that any vodka with a russian sounding name is itself russian and many videos angry gay bartenders were pouring stolichnaya vodka which should be pronounced by the way onto the ground in
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a fury but if those bartenders would take a closer look at the labels they would see that exported stoli is produced in bold in latvia by the s.p.i. group not in russia also according to the n.p.t. group beverage alcohol report the most popular vodka in america with a russian sounding name is smirnoff which is british owned and produced and bottled in various countries around the globe including the usa itself way to support the american worker people love to panic over the hip and trendy scandal of the month but everyone seems to be ignoring the fact that homosexuality itself is legal in russia and this punishable in many other countries including a death sentence in some of them and yet russia gets all the attention if people really wanted to affectively boycott any country with any laws even hinting against homosexuality they would have to hit them where it hurts and stop getting natural resources imported from countries like russia saudi arabia venezuela and iran and
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so on and so on that is a vastly more difficult proposition than pouring american made vodka onto the sidewalk but that's just my opinion. many times that go to the so. called me to see if these two. they all finished that you know in time. past. my dad is probably the kindest soul in the world. he can't abandon a child he knows that they wouldn't survive so he injurious to the. dream can be summed up in just a few watts russia and the world with no wolf and weed i want any children to wake
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up in orphanages firmly believe that the parents out there every child. my goal is. mission free cretaceous free in-store charges free. range month free. free. free. download free broadcast quality video for your media project a free media party dot com.
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hello and welcome to cross talk where all things considered i'm. going to be obama administration's continued insistence that the syrian regime must be punished for alleged use of chemical weapons has convinced few of washington's traditional allies the americans have said they will strike syria on their own if they have to what does this say about america's standing in the middle east in the future of international law.
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to cross out the ongoing conflict in syria i'm joined by george samuel in new york he is a fellow of the global policy institute of london metropolitan university and author of bombs for peace nato's humanitarian war on yugoslavia and in washington we cross to jason isaacson he is the american jewish committee director of government and international affairs all right gentlemen crosstalk rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i very much encourage it i want to make sure our guests understand and our audience that president obama has not decided at this point time as we're sitting down to regard this part of a program to attack syria so let's please keep that in mind george if i go to you first hear what you believe is the most important trend to use see going on in the arab world from tunisia all the way is to wait as we speak right now with the situation the united states and syria what's the most important trend in your mind well i think the. most important trend is. over sea instability and there is. clearly
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a wave of. uprisings in the in the arab world i think much of this has been fueled by outside. forces i think it the origin of this is. what happened in. the in the later stages of the iraq war around about the two thousand and six two thousand and seven when the united states decided that it wanted to thwart iranian supremacy because of the you know the shiites seem to be the dominant force now after saddam hussein there was a concern in washington that now iran would be the dominant player in the middle east and the united states saudi arabia and israel decided to. join forces with the muslim brotherhood the salafi has these alarmists in order to bolster sunni muslim strength in the middle east and thereby
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war to iran and i think that what happened a few years later is that the direct result of this and any india the odd thing is that it was in libya they had actually pressured gaddafi to release the various islam is who he had imprisoned largely at the behest of the united states and as part of the war on terror the extraordinary rendition program and so these very same people that get huffy had ridley's then joined forces with the united states and nato and and the and so to topple these regime and much the same is going on in syria where again the united states and saudi arabia got into bed with the muslim brotherhood there a few years before the uprising still plays ok jason it looks like intentional instability for the entire region but doesn't work out very well for american or
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western interests. thank you peter i just might add my breath is taken away a little bit by george's last comment so let me just provide an alternative explanation for what's been happening across the region for the last couple of years. rather than it being instigated by israel the united states and saudi arabia i believe what's been happening across the arab world since the very beginnings of a revolution in tunisia two and a half almost three years ago is something very different it's i believe it's homegrown i believe it's a desire on the part of people who have long been oppressed by dictatorships. trying to find a. way to claim we are again saying let's be clear these were dictators supported by western powers and the united states correct let's be clear here. you know the fact is a little more complicated than that i think that what we had was countries that have never had traditions of democracy but have been reasonably stable although
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frankly some of these countries libya supported terrorism syria as you know as long been a bastion of terror support i don't think it was a it was outside forces it was and it was mostly homegrown forces that led to the wave of revolutions that we've see in racing across the region now of course we're faced with a very very very complicated picture there are american interests at stake here there are saudi interests at stake here there are russian interests at stake here as well but i think what's important to focus on is the need to find some way of satisfying the the very definite expressed desire on the part of the arab people to have self-determination and to be free of oppression ok well then george then what about egypt and self determination. yes. the examples that we're seeing in libya we see in egypt are seeing also to a certain extent unity is. chaos
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killings. extremism. george george george i think you outline your earlier point if you are actually taking please take you up in your early twenty's in instability who does that serve instability serves who's interests here because you make an interesting point in your first comment well i tend to think that instability is the interest of the united states and united states has always been concerned that some kind of arab nationalist movement will become dominant in the middle east. and america has always wanted a kind of a much weaker divided arab world and i think it also serves the interests of israel which an israeli nightmare has always been that there should be a united arab world and the united arab voice speaking on behalf of the palestinians so long as the arabs are involved in this it was essentially was on
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the i think. the americans of this rate is a perfectly happy not to mention the americans vast military industrial complex that thrives on selling arms to the various in international actors ok jason to be fair go right ahead where time to go to complete nonsense of course we're also we're appearing on a network that is hosted by a country that has made quite a quite a handsome profit from selling weapons across the region over here a lot of countries in the world did make money out of ammo and maybe it's not you legally you're saying something like that of you know you know without clarifying it here these are transparent internationally respected of course it. i mean a lot of straights the united states sells a lot of arms in the middle east let's not forget about that also yes ok all right yes it does the united states the united states does so does russia so do other states as well but instability is not in the interest of the united states instability is very definitely not in the interest of israel
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a small country surrounded by hostile neighbors that have made war on it half a dozen times in the last sixty five years so you know it's ridiculous to say that this is somehow serving the interests of the united states or the interest of israel stability as internet is is in the interests of both of these countries as in the interests of the west in general it's frankly in the interest of russia as it is countering other regional threats the threat of terrorism and very definitely the threat of a of iran getting nuclear weapons capability ok george. well i find this extraordinary to say that if america wanted stability there was always a very simple way to go about stability there would have been to avoid getting involved in libya for all get off his regime was extremely stable and a good ally of the united states during the war on terror the americans could have helped the russians to get geneva two off the ground work out and a peace accord in syria. so the united states could have definitely avoided
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invading iraq and destroying that country if you want stability if there's a very easy way to go about it and none of the things that the united states and nato have done ever going to civility you don't cause the billeted by invading a country and bombing it ok jason interesting point you want to reply please. it is an interesting point let me just let me say if i can stick this back in my ear. what happened in libya was not the united states invading libya was a much more complicated story you may recall it was an uprising within within libya itself against a brutal dictator the united states was a very reluctant partner in this international coalition the one about trying to help indigenous forces topple the terrible dictator each of these countries had a very different path of revolution very different path of transition and very different levels of success frankly we haven't seen a lot of success may be. what is the playing out right now in syria maybe the most
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difficult case that we're likely to face in this in the revolution the history of revolutions that we're seeing across the arab world ok george maybe each country has been different in their experience has been different but it seems like the outcome is always the same go ahead. yes i mean what else to remember all of these interventions have one goal in mind which is regime change the united states seized on the situation in libya in order to effect a regime change i don't know why jason says that united states was reluctant and i'd say it was not reluctant there was a united nations resolution that said that we should do something to protect civilians no way did it say that we should stop bombing and lobbing missiles in order to overthrow gadhafi this was the united states britain and france together decided on this objective the united states has been hankering for an intervention in syria for ever since this. crisis started in march two thousand and eleven it
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has had some recent curity council resolutions reject it and then finally it is seized on this chemical weapons story in order now now it can get its intervention off the ground the goal is always the same regime change use force. with some insurrectionist on the ground in order to topple a regime that the united states does not like and so you know the goal is to overthrow the regime but of course stability is never the outcome would always be instability all right gentlemen i'm going to jump in here we're going to go to we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion on syrian state of art.
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they were ready to do anything for their country. is to love the country more than yourself if you joined the military for any other reason that you're probably not going to have a good day they were tools in the hands of the state now they live remembering the past which is impossible to get rid of. the war. but however good people do get hurt. and i've heard good people empty silent. a lot. but would prefer not to be sometimes i feel like. i should have died over there. because. i saw
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some people who. mirror is cheaper than target. on our. shoulder my language is what i will only react to situations i haven't read the reports so i'm not in a position to the know i will leave them to state park to comment on your latter point i come on to say it's ok because i'm going to talk you know. no more weasel words. when you vade a direct question be prepared for a change when you throw a punch be ready for a. freedom of speech and a little down to freedom to cost. ok. i dave across it while going to attend your oliver jane it's a little while in the middle of the chesapeake bay on the virginia shod. back out
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on. a rampage here all in the chesapeake bay probably one of the best there is an attempt to call fred. this is the result that your attend your island before the channel was cut oh here. they are. as go all. right here are some of the headstones from the graves it for you this is a fruits that's what we don't want happen to taint your all and we want to get some protection in the make sure that we don't go into the chesapeake bay like uppers did in other communities. right on the scene. first street. and i think pictures.
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on our reporters twitter. and instagram. will be in the know. on. welcome back to cross talk where all things considered i'm peter lavelle true mind
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you were discussing the crisis in syria. ok jason i'd like to go to you when looking at trends in the greater middle east how is the relationship between the united states and saudi arabia plus i mean this is a very very conservative regime there's ample evidence that it exports jihad it supports them and things like that i mean how can that be positive for the united states and in the intermediate term long term and for the region for the people that live on the ground it's a it's a complicated relationship you're right peter there has been a history of support for jihadist movements for. dresses across asia that have taught the worst kinds of lessons about extremism and intolerance anti-semitism as well he's of anti-semitism as well and i thank you for pointing that out peter anti-semitism as well but let us also say saudi arabia is important energy supplier
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to the united states and to the world in general that saudi arabia has been supportive of efforts to advance a regional peace has been also key ally of the united states in keeping a close eye and and the possibility of something more than a close eye on the danger posed by iran's pursuit of chemical would be of nuclear weapons and also its support of terrorism it's a problematic relationship but and. the result has been generally an important ally in the arabian peninsula georgie it doesn't seem like it's been there either positively it seems the more that are problematic to me that's going to work as well go to georgia new york it's more than problematic ok when you let loose these type of people you can't control them later we've seen this from the movie. and i stand to the present. yes exactly. was a story the other day that when the prince bandar visited president putin in russia
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he told putin that well why don't you drop us sad for us and then we promise that there won't be any chechen terrorist activity during the sochi winter olympics so here is a value in your saudi officials essentially acting like a mafia down. with the president of russia saying that well you do what we won and we want to unleash terrorism in russia and this is been the saudi game long it has been doing this for years and years going to various countries and threatening terrorism because it has the power i mean it is it has enormous resources at a disposal and it has been the chief exporter of terrorism in the world so there was this fraudulent war on terror that we're that we've been waging and are still waging. against the very states that have had nothing to do with terror and have
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always been the the anti. saudi elements within the middle east so we've had the war against syria a war against iraq or both and against libya all three of which had nothing whatever to do with al-qaeda these were always secular anti islam is anti salafi as regimes the very opposite the weather was the supposedly which should be the allies and in fact weren't defacto allies of the united states in the war on terror and now on our targeted by the united states in cahoots and at the at the behest of saudi arabia the chief sponsor of terrorism in the world ok jason do you think saudi arabia vision for the greater middle east is a positive vision go ahead go ahead you know. i find it. in an awkward position of having to defend the values of a country with which of course i have huge problems but but it's an important
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strategic relationship for the united states there it's a democracy deficit there's a values deficit there is a terrible history of support of extremism various kinds around the world and of course in its own country but it is an important strategic partner of the united states in defending the gulf and defending other interests i wouldn't go beyond that i there is truth in some of what george is saying about the danger that has been posed by that country but it is an important relationship for the united states well george i mean at the end there's an ability and that and that region and it's a vitally important energy supplier let's not forget that only all know that but i mean the values that are applied for some people and values that applied not applied for others i mean this is that one of the reasons why the and i'm going to go to georgia this is one of the reasons why america is reputation in the middle east has plummeted it's just it's duplicitous it's apocryphally all of the time all of the time george. yes exactly because the allies of the united states in this in this current conflict in syria before that in
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libya are saudi arabia qatar the various gulf states which are the worst regimes in the world and. which actually you know repress. political movements when they're inconvenient to them such as in bahrain at the very time when they were sponsoring the. fists in libya so what what we're happens is the united states then says oh well that is the is our allies you know they they are there so they're very good for us and they said provide us the billeted in the gulf but they provide no stability in the gulf i mean the the goal is basically to control the in energy supplies in the in the middle east and and this cannot be good for the rest of the world when the energy supplies in the middle east are going to be controlled by one bloc of powers
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and can therefore threaten the rest of the world with by cutting them off on the energy supplies so therefore this is something that is actually dangerous for the rest of the world and. ok i mean i think we all agree that saudi arabia is an important i need to be a supplier but jason. what about the fact that if the united states in all three of us on this program agree about energy but so he really looks at it through religious prism ok sunni against shia in it isn't that going to drag the united states into making choices that we you've already agreed to that are not convenient choices based on our values. peter it's an extremely messy world and it's a very messy region and the united states has very difficult options and sometimes very problematic friends but i think that given this very complicated equation that the united states has to play with and not just the united states i think that it's
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it's generally been on the right path of trying to support stability trying to encourage efforts toward political reform against corruption against oppression against intolerance but it is been very problematic and yes you know jason lies let me ask you not always been on the right side of the ok i agree with would you like to see an arab spring in saudi arabia and bahrain and in kuwait and qatar would you like to see that. peter i really don't want to sit on your program and encourage revolution across the arab world that's democracy and putting we've been promoting democracy and what do you see still isn't it all want to see we would all want to see we would all want to see an embrace of reform an embrace of democracy it's a complicated process and it's helpful when it happens based on foundations and principles that are widely accepted by the populace and have some historical roots and frankly that's been missing and deprived of the people of the arab world for generations we hope that that can be grown in time but it's not going to happen
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overnight ok job george where is that deprivation come from. i don't i don't see it i am it i suppose i see is. increasingly. using it again it's the islamism to topple regimes and to exert human the over the rest of the middle east and i think that is a very bad thing because i think the very people that the saudis sponsor all the worst elements in the middle east they are the most extreme the most dangerous elements and these are the people that saudi arabia is using in order to. far more civilized far more. advanced states and therefore the ultimate outcome has to be something that is very dangerous so we call the spring. is in the sea that you know with the cannibals the other
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that are running rampant in syria. i think want to go to jason. i think and an alternative reality and i think maybe closer to the reality is is the other pole that's that's that's driving these negative forces in the region and that comes from iran and it comes from syria countries that frankly are very heavily supported currently in protected by russia but countries that poses an enormous terrorist threat and strategic threat to the whole region to the west to your country and i fear that if we get all of our time focusing on the danger posed by saudi arabia and ignoring the huge danger that suppose well i don't know if i can go to your door and i don't see that as i don't see iran invading any countries i don't see syria invading any countries i see them all besieged ok george you have yes absolutely i disagree i have. no idea
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george. syria was an ally of the united states in the war on terror i mean it was a very actively cooperating in the in the extraordinary rendition program moreover the in the say the same way to go that goes for iran and i don't see way we can say to syria well what's the evidence that syria is a sponsor of terrorism in the world i mean syria is certainly align with hezbollah that hezbollah is a political movement in lebanon and when it comes to. his neighbor i mean i really don't. it is going to really spend time as i mean extremely very has been extremely helpful towards israel in the golan heights and it's created no problems at all for israel since one thousand sixty seven but on. the same if i go ahead ok just a few wars in the background just a few words in the background but not recently ok just supporting hezbollah which
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is not just a political movement but happens to be a terrorist organization resistance times have gotten out and change the city from jason i wrote in to this i hate them out they are going to run through my hate to interrupt my guess like this one not everyone in the world looks it has been was a terrorist organization a small number of countries do aligned with the united states ok go ahead jason give you the last word go ahead go ahead. peter i just missed what you just said as well as a terrorist organization the resistance that is supported by syria is not helping us helping our side helping our side right now killed his own people and you're saying some of the friends of the political organization that's nonsense ok it's a political organization that really gets to what is a shame that go ahead ruin us as a result of the israeli invasion of lebanon and one hundred to one hundred others that's all i wanted to invade lebanon and then. the shiites the shiites in lebanon had been very pro israeli up until the one nine hundred eighty two invasion of the rise of the hizbollah all right gentlemen excellent debate we had two great sides
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here many thanks to my guest in washington and in new york and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at the see you next time and remember tough rules. wealthy british. markets. find out what's really happening to the global economy.
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for a no holds barred look at the global financial headlines in two kinds a report. put it on your. own. pleasure to have you with us here today.
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and. i. mean. i'm.
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german intelligence shares obama's confidence that the assad regime was behind last month's alleged chemical attack in syria as washington continues building a case for a military strike while in the u.k. . revelations that a british company with quantity a license to explore potential not gas stations to syria because the government has facing tough questions about how that was allowed to happen. to the kitchen president morsy will stand trial for inciting violence in the murder of protesters amid accusations from his supporters that the case is politically motivated.


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