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tv   Cross Talk  RT  December 11, 2020 7:30pm-8:01pm EST

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hello and welcome to cross talk where all things are considered on peter lavelle in january there may be a new american president but what won't change is washington's stance towards iran is military conflict inevitable what is the value of diplomacy if one side fails to honor agreements and what are iran's options. to discuss this and more i'm joined by my guest adam roosevelt in washington he's a national security analyst as well as a g.o.p. strategist and omar we have scott ritter is a former intelligence officer and united nations weapons inspector and into and we have mohammad marandi he is
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a professor at the university of toronto gentlemen crossed out rules in effect that means you can jump any time you want and i always appreciate it ok let's go to professor marandi interim 1st professor marandi even over the last year iran. saw the assassination of one of its. celebrated military officials probably the greatest. cherice hunter and killer in the world and then we have this scientist. over the last few days sas unaided and by all accounts it was an israeli operation we don't know to what degree the americans were knowledgeable of it but it doesn't really matter here so it looks quite likely a new administration will be coming into power in january there's a lot of speculation about the last days of the trumpet ministration and some saber rattling when it comes to iran and of course there is the jay c.p.o. way on the line here a lot of speculation about what bae may or may not do. what is your thoughts on
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this here in this transition because iran stays me islamic republic stays but american presidents come in go go ahead professor. well iran has been a around for a lot longer than the united states as i think your viewers know but the real problem is that buy in was a part of the obama administration and as vice president the sanctions that obama and biden impose on iran obama call them crippling sanctions these are the same sanctions that impose but trying of them brutal sanctions so while obama wanted to brutalize iranian women and children trunk run wanted to do the same thing. so. there's no real difference in the way in which they project u.s. power and on the other hand while trying to murder general so their money as you
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correctly pointed out the person who was. most important in the fight against isis and the defeat of isis it was the obama regime that initiated the war in syria they they were key to the rise of al-qaeda nice is true there are regional allies such as turkey tatar so you're rabia the israelis we know from the 2012 defense intelligence agency document the united states knew its allies were supporting the extremists between syria and iraq and we know from general since interview on al-jazeera the united states to a local decision to support this and we also know from jack solomon in his email to hillary clinton in february 2012 that he had made it that al qaeda is on our side
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in syria so there's no real difference in the way in which obama and biden treated iran and the region and the way in which trump treated iran however iran is going to get bite in this opportunity to change policy if the united states we implement the nuclear deal in full and they didn't and obama by the way they never fully implemented it despite the fact that iran that if they reverse of the sanctions and the brutality brutal brutal sanctions a trump imposes on ordinary runs if they reverse them go back to the deal the iranians will implement but the iranians are not might get into all that other so what about that there because as the professor rightly pointed out not the obama not only the trump walk away from the greyman the obama administration never completely implemented it here you know what kind of agreement could there be because it sounds to me all the noise coming from the biden orbit is that it would
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be a really high level of conditionality from the. any added on to what was the original g.c. v.o.a. is there any is a political stomach in in and washington to go back to that agreement when lee because that would be conditionality because most likely the iranians going to say hell no we had an agreement and you walked away from it go ahead. i think we need to understand from the start that the j c p o a was never a final american agreement. it's important also realize that the iranians knew this i mean if you go back 220132014 after rouhani was elected in 2013 in fact he was trying to get the supreme leader and and the iranian governing apparatus give a green light for continuing the secret negotiations that had begun under under the bush. doctrine dinners out i'm sorry and. the supreme leader
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was a little hesitant to he said you know you can't trust these people you can't trust the enemy the americans the americans don't negotiate in good faith he said we will we'll we'll agree to her roic flexibility so that you can go out there and you can deal with these people but you can't trust them the americans will never abide by the agreement and the iranians knew there from the start and they were right why does the american version of the agreement has to quarrel iranian surrender not just on the nuclear front but also dealing with regional issues like yemen iran support of hezbollah iran's support of a son iran's actions in afghanistan and iraq the united states wants all this so-called malign activity to cease they also want iran to give up their ballistic missile programs iran's i mean the one thing that gives iranian regional deterrence
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against israel in the united states is its own list think missiles. you know the ability to reach out and touch people with precision in a very deadly way. and so you know when when obama was negotiating this issue that isn't 14 they wanted all that on the table iranians said no and in the end the obama administration was compelled to accept a new clear only agreement with the idea that 2 things one. iran will never be allowed to have a uranium enrichment program even though the freeman says iran can have a uranium enrichment program they built in suicide clauses called the sunset clauses we pushed you know us down 152023 years but we were never going to let that expire the whole deal was we will engage with iran or have europe is with iran economically and soften the regime into saying my inspiration to have money and
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trade or we'll just give up our nuclear stuff so we have good relations with the west they don't understand iran suffered for 14 years under sanctions to get the deal that they got iran will never go back on the deal now or biden obama and biden when they conspired about j.c. pioli never thought that they would have to deal with the sunset clauses this was another administration's problem. let me pull an adam here i mean from a so far from our guest here i mean there is a there's a deficit of good faith here ok because you know you get into this kind of bizarre american paradigm if trump is for something you have to be against it ok and so trump was against the and then j.c. v.o.a. and so there was this reflex will then the democrats would support it in the majority of the primary candidates did. some for returning to the agreement but
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there would be so much conditionality just as scott is has pointed out here i mean you have the saudis and the israelis have a lobby inside the united states because then it's the saudis and then in the israelis most don't do not want this agreement they do not want to go back to what they want to completely fall apart so i mean it doesn't really matter what biden wants to do does it doesn't matter. in my thoughts on this is that it's a beat by plus one agreement i think a lot of the conversations been senator in the united states and israel the west left it well i understand they're right my point is that it's a coalition agreement so us reading it in return it will require accommodation there oldish and i would say that the deal that will sign are there obama a long term agreement had to be a space and implementation plan regardless we're talking about a change here where so even if the united states said we're going to implement all these things and abide by these things on contingency and you signing it the deal is so long that i wouldn't i wouldn't vision it being
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a phased approach just common sense wise and this is a military an economic agreement it's a very complex agreement that has a tremendous amount of are adamant sit here and i would say you know these agree it needs are always changing regardless of what you signed today so the thing about the j.c.b. away and what biden will do if he is the right the coming into his january. i think this is going to be a very different conversation because one there has been ill agreement that was signed too there wasn't going to trump a mish ration that cool now and then you had an assassination or ignorance omani an assassination of a nuclear scientist so iran has to make a decision about i would understand be a trust going back to the table with the american money really but really i mean you know and it would be when they really want they want iran to react in a mcgrath's of way and then they can say see i told you so that's obviously the plan that's going on here you know mohamed let me go back to you when you know and
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preparing for our reporting here i went through the mainstream media i've learned something from the mainstream media that i didn't know that iran's developing a bomb you keep seeing that over and over and over again without any evidence whatsoever even an american intelligence officials the irony i mean the. well you you know you tend to kind of trust here ok and but no i mean just go across states every single broadsheet every single cable station it's the same thing i mean this is why dealing with iran is going to be very difficult from the american side because they don't even acknowledge the basic facts that can be proven here all of this other stuff is invented propaganda this is intentional dating that's the situation here i mean you must be exasperated by it go ahead well i'm used to it i know. yes you're right and the people who are in charge of the united states are
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the same people who own the media so it doesn't really matter what the truth is in fact netanyahu since i think 1982 has constantly been saying that iran is going to develop a nuclear bomb and 2 or 3 years every 2 or 3 years he says it's your 3 years and i think by late 19 i think in 197997 he said that iran has a bomb present kemp build a bomb right now so you know the other copy again and the nonsense that comes from the united states is extraordinary in fact as we speak despite the fact that the americans on not implementing the nuclear deal the europeans are not implementing the nuclear deal the iranians are still partially fulfilling our late obligations and that is with regards to the. extra access that iran has given to the i.a.e.a. and therefore the access of the i.e. shows that iran is not developing
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a nuclear weapon and this organization has never made such a claim yet general traffic is a doctor fatheads it was a murder so he was a murderer all that thought he had to go to a hard break in after the heartbreak and continue our discussion on iran and the boston with ministration in washington state r.t. . which is a planet with 5 moods an atmosphere highly active geology and there is for a little corner of the ocean in syria or it could. be of those for biology is just far beyond our wildest imagination. imagine picking up a future textbook on the early years of the 21st century what are the chapters
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called gun violence school shootings. first it was my job it was my bill it was my savings i have nothing i have nothing to lose now i don't authorize alou for resources i look for jobs i look for everything i can to make this house. in law in the doing is. the road to the american dream paved with good refused it's this very idealized image of. americans look pasta the deaths that happen every single day this is a modern history of the usa america monarchy. are discussing a new school of economics alien economics this israeli brought about by negative interest rates means contact with the galactic federation.
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problem drugs don't always come from unscrupulous dealers but from pharmacies to in every state in the united states we seem very sharp increase in the number of people seeking treatment for addiction to prescription opioids and invaded america under the banner of medicine persisted with the pain but instead of trying to wean him off. oh she displayed those at their dose after dose if you don't and really became his drug dealer so who's to blame patients doctors manufacturers all the governments. welcome back to cross talk we're all things are considered i'm peter let me remind you we're discussing iran and
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a possible new administration in washington. because go back to scott scott i mean you know kind of going back to the tail end of our conversation for the break here i mean he i suppose it's kind of built in is that iran must want to bomb or it must have a bomb and that's why it's so dangerous because it if you can prove like i said today i and other intelligence agencies that it doesn't then it kind of puts the responsibility on the u.s. for walking away from an agreement that actually was working to one extent or another here i mean in the the the whole it's iran's threat kind of crumbles if it's not this evil country with his evil leaders wanting these terrible weapons go ahead well there are there's 2 aspects to this one is. the other is
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the potential for a bob neither acceptable for israel saudi arabia or the united states. and as a former weapons inspector i have to say that you know in 20022003 i really was going to get the benefit of the dow for me. because we had the historical precedent of north korea and iraq nations. nuclear weapons in and because north korea acquired nuclear weapons as any. covertly going out there and violating agreements covertly acquiring equipment building secret facilities enrichment capabilities. or a military purpose so now as an intelligence official you're looking at the data you're receiving about iran and they're out there doing the same thing firstly acquiring irena even richmond. and so you you you have a duty an obligation to be suspicious so you investigate. it but what i will say
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this is this is where it falls apart because this is where the intelligence. parted from. normal path of seeking truth and intelligence instead was captured by policy you have to get on the sea wasn't deny iran a nuclear weapons capability early on it became obvious that iran was not acquiring a nuclear weapon what iran was doing was acquiring uranium enrichment capacity most probably in support of a peaceful nuclear energy production capability and it's a member of the nonproliferation treaty treaty which means it has the right to have a some room to. write articles for the nonproliferation treaty gives iran for membership price the full fuel cycle inclusive of enrichment however slash comma iran did cheat iran didn't fail to declare things. so i'm allowed to raise an
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eyebrow and look askance a little bit and give info i read how you don't have automatic machine from which is until i investigate this further we can invest it further there is no evidence the posi isn't know about stopping iranian nuclear weapon it doesn't exist it's now about stopping the poke in show for iran to as some point in time develop a weapons depot in this is where uranium enrichment becomes important is really in the american position was not a single spinning centrifuge the problem with that is that is a complete departure from the now. so no in order to defend the not one single spinning centrifuge we have to manufacture a narrative that says iran is pursuing a nuclear bomb and this is where it tragedy and dr motion factors and it comes at you was an open timer of iran he didn't design it down well the next year larry signed it in and then he was involved more than procurement and that was a debt decades ago i mean on loan 98 he took over i think it was shaheed university
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in 1903 started to acquire or make. inquiries into a corey one centrifuge to do in skill laboratory experiments on the centrifuge behavior with your rhenium and cetera you know the theoretical kind of stuff you are going to build a bomb with 100 future no matter how long do you use it they were using so they the physics research center to go out and acquire this technology and such in 1980 that got shut down i think it got turned over and again i'm going off of you know people correct me if i'm wrong should mention 98 i think they're turned over to dr factors are they who took over a larger scale covert procurement activity in support of our geo you're reining in richmond facility that was installed. that's what this man did he was very good at it a rare rightfully views him as a hero he was a pure chairman agent he wasn't
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a weapons designer you know his assassination is much more of a publicly relations issue for the people that have it out for rent and you know and i'm in it the more i think about it it's really not about the g.'s e.p.o. way and never really has been and never has been about that because we even american intelligence know and inclusions that ran a long ago gave up on even wanting to acquire a bomb it's really about. the very existence of the islamic republic in the middle east as an alternative to sunni regimes like saudi arabia and of the u.a.e. here all the time is the greatest exporter of terrorism and it's so tiresome that they keep saying it over and cement iran's foreign policy and it's about the friends that are ranchhouse in the region and that's what that's what really irks them it's not really about j.c. you know way go ahead i completely agree with this statement is
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a much warmer broader conversation the term now being adapted around. world especially here united states is a great power competition we've got a lot of historical. information we've got a lot of historical events that have occurred in the regions or by iran you know the position with us has taken is that iran is essentially a terrorist backed and jerry sponsored state and that's why we're in the position we're in right now it isn't really carry us out of that calling or iran a terrorist state but it's their own people being killed through acts of terrorism isn't that quite curious why i think there's an tremendous amount of different perspectives on whether it's a state backed terrorist state or whether it's individuals who are operating in backspins and sell well conclusive way we've come to a position that needs said that iran is an adversary which is why we're even jayson's fabric why is that an address how does it get to that level that category
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of an adversary what threat is the is a red posed to the united states well i would say because i'm a former us military member you know i've been in the war are serving 2 campaigns outraced enduring freedom and freedom sentiment at the lowest level. there are killings in attacks that occur on innocent individuals there are campaigns or go on for decades there's a lot of history here this isn't just a back to the u.s. one day stated that iran was an adversary is no different than our aggressive nature in terms of our gains on russia and so we're going that that is a different degree depending on who you're speaking what i mean look at the history i'm looking at today's to be a bit but not like when you let me go to come in here i mean you know it me being one of the issues that was brought up you know that iran is killing americans in iraq you know i don't know if that is true but already very iran backed militias then i mean no one in the mainstream media or the adults in the political establishment posed the question like well why are we interact in the 1st place ok
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they never invited us there we invaded there immediately occupied you need. and they're blaming iran for them ok because the government in baghdad has sympathy isn't enough. filiation it with the government into round well who's fault is that ok maybe the adults in the room never you know can answer the most simple questions go ahead. that that's the problem really i mean when the united states supported saddam hussein gave him chemical weapons used against iranians and his own people i survived 2 chemical attacks i was a volunteer and a war to defend iran against saddam hussein then the united states turned against saddam hussein a saddam hussein then he became there anything we need their ally yesterday and they invaded iraq because of chemical weapons that he no longer had and because of the link to al qaeda i did americans and the saudis created in afghanistan
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a relationship that didn't exist they go into iraq and destroy the country and then the americans wonder why iraqis kill americans why there is resistance to the american occupation on afghanistan with the americans good honest why is it that there are any people killing americans it must be the fault of the iranians it must be the fault of the iranians but going back to a scott said and just it's just a point that i want to add to what he said the only reason why iran secret the acquired material to have a and richmond program was because they i am a was violating its commitments shiran because iran has the right to acquire the capability because of the united states and this actions that the united states imposed and the threats that the united states made no and she was willing to openly work with iran so he ran had to acquire these materials because it's
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a sovereign country it has or it has a right to do so so that's one issue but further the issue that i want to point out it goes. back to what you were asking. adam and that is why is he nice is hostile to iraq the united states was hostile to iran from day one the problem was the overthrow of the shop the problem was that iran pursued an independent foreign policy if the united states had behaved in a reasonable and rational way towards iran instead of helping saddam hussein give them chemical weapons and then afterwards of course sanctions and so on the relationship between iran and the united states today could have been a reasonable relationship you know it's got you know when. it it's very likely that we'll have divided government in january that will mean that a potential biden ministration the limitations on what kind of legislative agenda that he'll be able to pursue and that leaves one area where the president is very.
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more and more. moving without any kind of constraint and that is foreign policy here and i'm i really worry considering the people that he's surrounding himself with i mean these people have a track record of just unbelievable failure and i have to even say quite honestly very limited intelligence they have nice resumes and nice credentials ok but their foreign policy just decisions have been a deplorable i mean that's the only area where they're going to be only flex their muscles as foreign policy and you know russia and iran and his way on the back on the agenda last 30 seconds go to you scott. well i think you know there's when we talk about foreign policy we have to understand that nothing happens in a vacuum history is very important. you can say what you want about hizbollah would exist if israel did invade no it's not right and i said you know you could say what you want about who it was the saudi arabians have been invading north yemen and causing their problems for decades afghanistan you know we tend to forget that iran
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was working with us any solid viable ost 2001 afghanistan were the ones who we invited the iranians to come in to iraq when we invaded in 2003 and then we got upset because a majority shia population do things that i really wish we had more time because i think your list could go on in any other time i don't want to make my i guess in washington the mentor and what i think of you are watching us your darkie scenics and remember us up walls. little simple spear wasn't sure when you read of those lists nissho to show you just what that also has been. but so publish what in the months to roll
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a clip of him and he will quit this in the us will to quit causing months alone with. a new rush for the belief that it's all profit and you must know the right at the court of the what all of us most of them in 'd the state do it in you mustn't those like you with a clue post them also from the still place and you of all of the over ashamed in what all the money. would have stood since i got it i'm. not in the us those days. some of what they did that were in them with the buddhists. which is the point it would find. an atmosphere highly active geology and. water since your need. those for biology is just far beyond our wildest imagination.
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astra zeneca and the makers of russia's sports job agreed to call for the start of the effectiveness. vaccines. the united states sees a record. with figures now supposing the country's fatalities during world war 2. the international criminal court drops a probe into alleged war crimes by u.k. forces in iraq despite having a reasonable basis for the beautiful cities did take place. live from moscow thanks for joining us thoughts on all the law and daniel hawking.


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