western elite, which has never been good for those of the countries themselves. this is why those other countries are not sanction. russia as the west is demanding those countries, those western countries who want serbia to sanction russia. the same western countries who sanctioned serbia, demonized serbia who illegally bumps. why should? sorry i listen to them. i have his company here in asi international. we're back at the top of the hour, the latest. see them. ah . in the boonies to come to the russian state total narrative, i'd tied as i'm phoning the northland scheme, devastation. i'm not getting all sunset meet within

a 50 babel between. okay, so mine is 2000 speedy. one else about with we will van in the european union, the kremlin. yup. machine. the state aunt, rush up to date and split our t spoke neck. even our video agency, roughly all band to on youtube and pinterest and to school the question, did you think even close with mm ah i ah,

i'm after in regards you're welcome to going other guy. we're back and coming to you for now from a new location today. exactly 40 years. it's in several 1000. argent time troops sees the falkland islands. will malvina back from great britain before margaret thatcher's british army, took it back 74 days later. this is the annual e u china summit. its scheduled for the 2nd day to friday's peace talks between ukraine and russia. all this while the us band this program and this tv channel, fillable cost all around the world except in nature one line countries will join me now from room for this episode is former advisor to the urban union high representative, a common foreign and security policy. and conflicts for him founder. alas, crook, alistair, welcome back on going underground. let's begin with perhaps the need for you to remind us what you think is the start of this conflict and the reasons for the

conflict given that certainly in the european union where a descent is arguably band. we are told, almost hourly push in, invaded ukraine without provocation. oh no, it's very clear what we're dealing with israeli something and it's much broader than just ukraine. and both presidents pull in and she have both made said that this is about reordering. if you like the security architecture of the, the global security architecture away from a simple rules based order that is set by the united states in order to give these other states seats of the board. if you like to be able to have a discussion, there is really no communication. before that, there was

a very good analogy made by someone that it was like a chessboard and united states that at one end of the chessboard. and someone said, well to, to play this game of chess. and it was present sky back and present. he said not to one, there's no other at this game. we just simply turn the ball grant and then we play from the other side. and that's been going on really the whole for a long time. and now russia and china won her seat at the chessboard. they don't accept any longer. the united states simply comes the chessboard through 180 degrees and starts playing from the other side as well as their own. so they want a feature, the chessboard. that's what ukraine is about. was her a provocation. yes, because people have been warning from o, long time, 2007. even the present had of the cia in washington. when he was ambassador. and moscow said, if you move nato into georgia and ukraine,

the will be wall. it's inevitable. difficult, though, for china, the you, china virtual some a day to on, on the saturday. i'm not sure whether you will be, again lecturing china or about human rights. but despite the reaffirmation of the alliance, more than the lines between beijing and moscow, of course, poland, ukraine, italy, where you are, they are belton road countries. ukraine is one of the biggest investments in europe coming from china. how does china navigate that? how is it alive? to russia, even whilst these countries that are spearheading the conflict, certainly in information terms that they're on washington side, there is a very pros rapport between russia and china. and i think the

decision, if you like to disassociate from europe and from the west, generally was probably taken even a year before the famous declaration that was made by both the chinese and the russian presidents in bay haynes, where they said they will no longer put up with, if you like, the american, impose global order that we are going to change that and go to compare the glo broader. and of course, that has caused a great deal of anger and also anxiety in the west about this prospect. but i think it's very clear where it's going because they do coordinate very close and we've seen rushes or response rushes responses. it has a list of the nations with whom it does business. transact the problematic with them. and those that are not really excluded,

probably won't even be able to get visas to travel. i think china will do it in its own time. but this is the model that we're going to see. and of it was a 2 spheres to separate fields. and remaining on the fence is going to be so uncomfortable and so painful that it will become impossible eventually. so people will have to choose which, which side they want to reside on. we saw a bit of that with the let was more complicated not, but with must go telling the are again, you know, you want, you want gas. ok. paying one no more dollars. no more euro's after you stole foreign reserve accounts in the united states in europe. yeah. some people actually commented that leaving $300000000000.00 in foreign assets in, in dollars me will be in moscow trick. it seemed all too easy. so that immediately

russia could retaliate by saying, it must be charging roubles when it comes to energy resources in europe. what do you think? say berlin, where, where energy resources are all important from russia. and we will, the lights go out, they are talking about the need, perhaps the rationing. but then the g 7 says, absolutely no. if you're, you're breaking a contract and you must judge if not in dollars than in euro's, they should just also say, we're not regulated by the british regulator anymore. but as you know, nato allied countries all say, this is unprovoked for moscow. well, 1st of all, i mean that you've raised a number of points in this, in this issue, but it was provoked essentially by the taking all if you like instruments, death in 2 months, from a cold foreign reserves and those death instruments. i mean, if you like,

when you simply see from o capital as the united states and europe has done, i mean, that's a breach of contract to that is a care breach of the contract to pay on those contracts like us, treasury's, or on currency. they are just, if you like, an obligation to pay those who kind of so if you like, in a sense, russia can always plead force measure. now as to changing the contract, i heard a lot of that from european countries. thing though. well, you know, we can't change the contract, it's on changeable. but you're a big proposed precisely that to russia not so long ago because they said they didn't want any longer to have long term contracts with russia. they'd like to have sport price for that gas. and we're moving in that direction and we'd like to go on to the spot market for the prices. so let's change our contract that way. so if it was all right for the you to propose that why if it not, all right,

for russia to propose that they now pay and why it shouldn't be too difficult for them. ryan one the we all know this is an underlying reason why they don't want that because there's a fear that the financial system which is already shifted. the global monetary system is already shifting away from fear money, which basically has no rail backing to it at all. it's just a promise to pay nothing more. and the promised pay by putting more money. but moving away from that to a commodities and the acid base currencies, i currently use it up based on real things like either gas or oil weight, whatever the ram, ram, metals, oh gold. and this is where we seem to be moving. i mean, it was 971 that mixed and did away with the gold would now quietly, without much attention in the press, russia had me establish

a gold window for rubles. and that translates also into an equivalent price of roubles for the dollar of about $75.00. since they did this, we've seen the rule shoot up in value against the dollar. and then they've also said we'd like to have, you know, payment roubles, which means that these foreign country companies in the european union are going to have to go buy roubles. and that is going to push through, pull up further and make it a much more very valuable currency as a trading instrument to. so, you know, paradoxically, you remember, it was only in the beginning of much the french finance was saying our aim is to collapse the russian economy and collapse of the robot as

part of that, he said that at the beginning of much, and now one months later we see in the financial press, many commentators talking about this is beginning of the end of the global monitoring system because of the crisis of confidence that ultimately, you know, it worked so long as the dollar was vaguely in line with commodities. with phillips, they made the mistake of sanctioning russia so heavily. russia is the key pin of all commodities. food resources, oil, gas, precious metals. everything comes from russia. if they don't have supply lines. so when they do that, they've made the mayhem in order of the commodity market, and that's affecting the currency when it comes to the way the rest of the world sees this conflict. i'm not sure what you thought about the western rewards nation

reports that saudi arabia, the u. a refused biden's phone call. we know that suddenly a team was sent to venezuela, where one think tank said, 40000 were killed by us sanctions against the madura government. there the world food program is warning about wheat prices in egypt because we buy, does shillinger and russia together have the kind of infrastructural clout, to be able to save the world from global famine, caused if you believe moscow by nato expansion, eastwood. and if you believe nato caused by vladimir putin there, oh i, it is not so straightforward because we have a major problem with food rising, which is not just concerned with the war in ukraine. although ukraine and russia

combined produce something like 35 percent of global weeks. so yes, to that extent. but it is also something that is more than that because there are other factors involved in it festival. we have a drought and much of the middle east, which is affecting production food production across the middle east. so that's an important fact. but also because some of the sanctions on russia have affected important areas of fertilizer. other things that are necessary in food production, certain gas is necessary also, and all of these are being blocked at the moment by sanctions. and so it's causing a huge problem, and in some cases, farmers in the western are planting crops or planning to fun crops because the price fertilizers has shot up the components to these either come from better,

russo, they come from russia and they're just not available at the moment, so one part of it is sanctions. one part of it is the context is taking probably from ukraine. another part of it is drug. and another part is the fact that in many parts of the world, the attempt to move towards a green world from the sort of, if you like, the us agenda has actually met the crops not being planted. they're called several components to it. and i think this problem is certainly we are going to feel the effects and prices, inflation. food is going to be very expensive. inflation and europe is soaring, as it is in the united states and many other places. this is becoming a major crisis. the sanctions in many ways, europe as not sanction russia, it's sanctioning itself not being able to get things like fertilizers,

not being able to get things that are necessary. food that is necessary is, is sanctioning europeans going to make it much harder for people to survive on incomes because the price is going up rapidly as golf. stop you there. more from the forward valencia, european union tie, representative a common foreign and security policy. after this break. what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy confrontation, let it be an arms race, his on offense, bearing dramatic development only personally and getting to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very care to kill time time to sit down and talk with

welcome back. i'm still here with all the british diplomat and founder convicts for him as to crook. do you think that the european union just doesn't understand? you were an advisor to the equivalent of the you foreign minister because at the same time as the rest of the world may be hold fast lula and bulls, maybe even ruler. and certainly boston are in brazil in south africa. all these countries in the global south, defacto back russia, as seen by nato. meanwhile, in europe, the war by russia is paid for by european union money, de facto $100000000000.00 fortune magazine said, comes from the europe, ian union into russia to pay for gas oil. and coal, at the same time, as you just had their in effect, sanctioning themselves. and berlin is telling its citizens to and perhaps rash and

gas and all over western europe. they're talking about some of them talking about mass fuel poverty. i think you raise are really important question because i don't see any sign that the europeans did any gave any thought to the strategic consequences of what they were doing. they were so caught up in the sort of sense of the struggle against russia are, again, put in the dictator and all of us and has become a sort of fervor in europe all everywhere. there are sort of blue and yellow symbols of ukraine. it's become such a firm that i don't think they really thought, i mean europe cannot manage as it is. they cannot get gas from anywhere else that will substitute for russian. guess that's just obvious. the americans have promised a small amount of new liquefied natural gas. but that will cover about 4 percent of

the u needs. your required 40 percent. augusta is not going to be able to supply, it's not going to get supplied. so why did they go into these things without any thinking? and then suddenly they say, well, we're going to divest ourselves from reliance on russian or oil and gas within the yeah. how i mean, how big are we plan for this? is this serious, how you do going to do that? you know, you conscious change the thing overnight then surprised when russia is okay. now paying roubles, did they not consider that possibility? did they not think where it was going to take? has they not consider the impact on inflation and inflation is soaring in the europe, ian union at the moment while they still stay on a monitoring economic policy, which is not that still doing quantitative easing,

negative interest rates effectively and buying all the bond this the certain countries produced to find from that that might mean, how long can you go on and that sort of basis when inflation is you know, the inflation figures highly manipulated. but we're talking about large figures double digit tickets in europe. in reality, even if they say it's a little less and people are going to feel a huge amount of pain, the costs of gas and electricity like can, you are going to go up 50 percent. they've gone up 50 percent, they'll probably go up and up a 100 percent before the end of this year. how people going to survive with this? have they not made any consideration? has they not posted through? they've cut off all the links. they've created a sort of uncut against russia. they can't even talk to, to, to take them to russia, aut futon at the moment. they've so cut themselves off in their sort of enthusiasm

and their excitement for protecting european values and to what they see as a sort of barbarian culture of russia. it's not that of course, but that's how they seem to see it. and so, you know, i, that's why i'm very pessimistic that they can come up with a rel solution. well, of course, joe biden assure his europe that the frac gas from the us will be on time and important commentators and think tanks in nato countries. constantly talk about cutter saving the day if but both of those rubbish actual contract to the americans that the european union produced doesn't have any commitment to that extra 50000000000 cubic meters of gas. it says america will do its best endeavors to meet the best endeavors this follow

house gotta said, formerly, i know german minister went then came back and said that they will help us with gas . but actually doha, i said fully, we never made that commitment. we couldn't make the commitment, we don't have the capacity to make that commitment. i'm very sorry. if we cannot replace rush and gas so where, oh you, is it coming from? well, as you know, and as you alluded to, for instance, u. k prime minister bars johnson talking about it's the principle that math is, this is about the foundations of the european ideal philosophically, even even the enlightenment being talked about. obviously, one feels it strangely when it comes to the banding of free expression and free media obviously or, or t comes to mind because he g, d, n and prestige. a media is band a dissenting media. zelinski has,

as has been the subject gave a huge p o or operation in western europe and nature aligned countries. what do you think he faces at home in ukraine, as per the far right elements in ukraine society and, and his in effect, putting needs to protect him as piece talks go forward. if a piece deal is, is to emerge. i mean, it's, it's a complicated picture, but we do know that lensky, of course, i mean, all of these zoom meetings with parliaments and hoping carefully choreographed and someone has provided the videos and the, the means to do this. and that almost certainly as the united states, and the question really comes down to the issue of is the united

states ready? all, all of europe can states because some of them don't seem to be really ready to for a long war, or do they want to short for in the crane and a political settlement. and it's not clear that, that the fission has been made. we see that i think you mentioned yourself, the start was, you know, so far there was nothing and that would be another meeting made wrong. i don't think soleski is a free agent in this. he is very close. you know, even with his background, he is surrounded by members of the self and right fact groups and works very closely with some of the leaders of those groups. and are they ready for a thief or any of the process? it's not clear that that is the case, but it's often appear in russia has certain objectives for this

a military operation. and it is still possible that if they feel they've achieved those objectives, they may feel that the best thing is just to go and leave and the dawn. yes. good. now, scott republics will be look after themselves and their own way once the russians have completed them and a trail ration the black sea coast will be similarly, probably an autonomous region may be west and ukraine will be taken by the pose, maybe parts of the other parts ukraine will be taken by hungry. we don't know quite certainly the polish prime minister has made it very care. they have territorial dishes because most of that land on the west devolve and all of that were polish. richard lee and he said they have territorial needs requirements from, from u. k. and i think there was

a long conversation between the polish president and that has bite. and when he was in walsall, when the polish president was getting very strong polish military should be able to go into the ukraine and take some of that plan that was originally. so, i mean, we may see something very different as the outcome if the comp negotiate to metric outcome. we may find this a sort of de facto, can i say that takes place in your crime? i'm not sure who that would suit if anyone, but i mean one can say that is not going to be an option. might be the only thing that emerges photo via, for lack of anything better to arrive from the situation. presumably, china wouldn't appreciate that too much with its close trading days with kiev, but if billions of dollars worth of weapons continues to be poured into ukraine by

nate to align countries, notably the united states of many see he is prolonging the war. can we see an uptick in the violence? we've seen the pictures of so many refugees, let alone dead bodies of civilians. can we see an uptick in increased violence, or will nato, along with, with businesses and the, and the corporations of the planet eventually have to back down to save. well, to save the planet in effect, you know, the united states continues to pull money in. they've just announced all money and other other trash and more weapons to go there. i'm not sure that they can actually get those weapons into you. great, because the russians have been very adept destroying weapons, supplies and warrens dance inside you even close to the polish border. so it's not so clear that this is really possible. but nonetheless, can,

can the war go on? i think there is a come within, let's call it a camp within washington that would like it to become a quiet like house guy. this done was the, the says it union all those years ago when i was that would they like to do the same? some one camp does, that's largely the state to pub position. i think another one, like the pentagon, is much less asked about that much less enthusiastic because it feels that this might lead to a bigger conflict with russia. cook. thank you. that's it for the show. if you're watching this on saturday, it will be we played on monday and keep in touch my social media if it's available in your country. and remember, you can continue to watch going on the right after globally on tv outside major airline countries, and always on odyssey and out to a

government debt to say, we should impose punitive measures in such a way that only the other side is hurt and out there now people do not so to speak, do not have to make any sacrifices. only the other side has to make a sacrifice and we have to push the other side into short them that action through a kind of collective punishment. because that is what the sanctions on this large scale. and in that regard, sanctions a few more and out against human rights. with

tony as were public officials say mariel, paul is now almost completely controlled by russian forces and the battle for the city may soon be over. and i'll take correspondence on location, meet with a tongue for the following attack on the train year near. not see as up with a, with the head rushes face agency sounds a response to his request, economic sanctions to be lifted on the agency. stressing that international space station cooperation is only possible if we're strict in that way.