the hello and welcome to cross ok. we're all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle. what has happened to europe? why is it's a rhetoric so bombastic and militaristic? why are europe's leadership so afraid of democracy? why is the continuation of the ukraine more so important to them? and what does any of this have to do with so called european values? the cross walk in europe. i'm joined by my guess that's nielsen in stockholm. he is a senior analyst, the discipline club in cambridge. we have james spears. he is a historian and journalist and a leg jacks, and we crossed the dining mcadams. he is the executive director of the ron paul institute for peace and prosperity. our gentlemen cross lock rules and effect, that means he can jump any time you want. and i always appreciate, daniel, let me go to you 1st. you got up early as for this, for this program and it's always much appreciated. you know, i, i, you know,

collectively, i think a lot of us know about politics and history, even the media. but when i think about europe, i think we all need degrees and psychology because i don't understand the bomb that a bombastic rhetoric that is coming out of europe when europe is experiencing its worst security crisis since the 2nd world war. they seem to be going in the wrong direction. i say that with a little bit of sarcasm. daniel. yeah, it's like they do a certainly with the defeated the by the administration of things they've lost. there is on the truck. because in with the incoming trumpet ministration, there's a different attitude towards the ukraine war on us. not necessarily an attitude that i think will solve the war or in the war as quickly as president trump had hoped. perhaps i also think that he's not getting adequate information as well, but the, the entire war in ukraine has become kind of like a religion to the european leadership now. and they, they can't abandon that religion, even as the church, so to speak is crumbling all around them the,

their faces crumbling all around them. defeat is being handed to them. they still refuse to accept and understand the fact that the world has changed fundamentally looms in these last 4 years. well, and that's exactly, i mean, a good daniel really went straight to the point here. it seems to me that europe is not suffering from a security problem. it's suffering from an ideological problem. it can face the fact that it's made some very tragic mistakes. it can face the fact that it put too much face in the united states. the united states would eventually go its own way and donald trump is somebody, it's very difficult to put faith in overall. i mean, they can't accept that. they've made mistakes. they cannot accept that they're ideology is failed and failing but match that. this is very true. i'm an avid reader of all of the literature and the kind of literature i, i swore that whole and i read it and i've always done so. and i would like to make that it's psychological comparison right now to the collective

e u countries. with that all the oscar wilde's dorian gray it's, it's a situation where the european union, for some reason, believes that we as your opinions are moral morally superior to everyone else. but, but we forget what we have done in afghanistan and gauze in iraq or in syria. and you have to remember dorian gray. i mean a he, he was given a, he was given a mortality and he remained beautiful outwardly. but he failed to see his inner failings. and this is the situation where the european union is at today. now whether do you repeating union like dory, and we'll take out the knife and destroy itself and kill itself. i don't know. i think the jury is still out on that one. perhaps the european union will wake up before that happens. but otherwise, i would say that perhaps we have to dismantle this hubris of the european union.

and once again, start to rebuild it because maybe it's gone too far. it's psychological late for the european leaders to be able to see themselves for what they truly are. yeah, i mean james, um, obviously the u. k is no longer part of the european union at least to formally. but you know, we look at this europe in general. we look at the european project. it was the promise was on, on 2 pillars, prosperity and security. well, this crew of it's running the operation, you're getting negative returns, you're getting less and less security and you're getting a lot less prosperity. isn't that obvious to leaders in the, in europe? i mean, it's obvious to the rest of us, james. well, that's a very good point and i think, you know, most europeans have not known anything else as a liberal democracy. and there is this just ongoing belief. it has worked,

it would work. if we just give it a bit more time, it will get itself out of this process. again. the problem is nothing works and the government's look like they're doing nothing to fix it. i don't know. so there is not just across as of liberalism as a crisis of thinking about what liberal democracies. i mean if you just take the sanctions. now most of the people sanctions have not committed any crimes. now none of that actually, you know, it works in the way of punishing people. none of that works in the way of science in europe and it's expansion has stored as well. and the reason it's expansion just just because while in europe is not united, and it's not looking at the root causes of some of these things. it's not considering the national specifics of certain countries. it wants to bring in. just one more interesting point is i'm preparing for a conference next week all summer and yeah, well, i was looking back to kind of clips from clinton's, from the quality and, and the economy is 10 years ago. and you have people like tony brands and sending

the car to you. the russian view point is being down played a well yeah. and it still is it called change? it's secure. the economist europe's policy on ukraine rest. stone pretending the season corrupts. you know, it's not one of the, i mean, just a big james, you a bit. so you hit the, the operative word there. i'm going to go to daniel, right. there's a lot of pretending going on here. it's not fact based. it's not reality based. but worse, so obviously, europe would want to have some kind of modus operandi, some kind of a compromise with russia for their mutual security. but none of that is in the mix right now. daniel, they're all pretending. they're all pretending, but you know, i, i suspect you might be a fan as well. peter, but i'm a big fan of allister crook. and he had an amazing up a piece this week called one quite morning. amazing. the dollars crowns up in which she discussed. the philosopher, the principle less for a manual, todd, and his writings about the end of communism and how he compared it to the end of

liberal democracy. and he talked about after the fall of communism, he realized that wasn't just a means by which you organized society, but had in fact become a religion in itself. and i think that's what we see now with liberal democracy. it's become a religion within itself. and any heretic now has to be burned at the stake. we saw recently a couple of german journalists were sanctioned by the e u. because of the reporting on russia. they started reporting the truth on what's happening in the war and ukraine, and they were sanctioned. their heritage x you see that the off day is threatened with being banned because of their heresy. we saw elections being over thrown in romania because of heresy. cheating on elections and romania over heresy. over and over again. it's b as morphed into a kind of bizarre religion. and when your religious beliefs are challenged, rather than sit and question them, you tend to circle the wagons and, and dig down even deeper. and that's what it looks to me. what as, as europe,

europe is doing right now. yeah. and that's, i mean, it's daniel already mentioned. i mean there's, when things don't work out well and not as they are planned to look for others to blame. everyone is to blame for what's going on in europe except for the leaders themselves. of course, and it's a, it's a very basic, psychologically, it looks like a logical defense. everyone does it. and the thing is now that the, the european leaders are trying it in the lack of having a true liberal democracy as it was once forced out to become their, their starting basically to build a culture of, of the untouchable and sacred military nato establishment. so, so, i mean, if they are, instead of having a culture of liberal democracy, basically a cause of justice where you have a collective passion for individual rights for the citizens. europe is now building

a cult of nature where you can argue that everything military, it's a defense against the other. there by the european leaders don't have to deal with all the problems of the disintegrating welfare states within the european union. yeah, and change, i mean, when it comes to nato countries as a collective, none of them take responsibility because it's in alliance. okay. it's a collective, so what germany says with friends, so they, they, they, they walk away from their responsibility this, this cult of nato is rather rather terrifying. i think, always a few years ago on twitter. i mean, you had to talk about nato in secret terms. i think that's the right word. it's a sacred organization. what it's like, it's a military organization, there's nothing safer about it. james, a, it's a military organization that was sets up specifically to go to more if it has to,

you know, a lot of british and european defense spending still goes on weapons that were built in the seventy's designs to flatten most car that they're still paying for so yeah, and i mean, you already have to go back 20 or 30 years and you know, there were opportunities to rethink security. there were good opportunities on this site. well, the, i see the problem is that the scholars who wrote them has apparently not read that wrong book and changed to fits in results info. now. well, it's a and same with you in all of us on this program. no the term, but it's been been forgotten in western parlance is indivisibility of security. remember that phrase that was a phrase that they always see, you know, everybody must feel a feel safe, not at anyone's expense. james, you never hear that anymore. you never hear that. and i've seemed to remember as well around 2006 that was listens of level stock. yeah. in terms of economics or

that scope, what happens to that? um, well i can tell you what happens to that. it was the people in whitefield and in brussels, looked at the ration economic union and dismissed it. they didn't want to, it was dismissed as a back. cool. so sorry if you just missed something, isn't that cool that, that you don't need to be secure? you know, it's just wishful thinking. i think it's the 1st. well, it's wishful thinking because it's i, it's under, it's under guarded by an id i. i'd be ology and the match has already mentioned it . i mean there's this sense of security. how could western liberalism be defeated by russia? those people? this is what it's all about. the problem is, is that with that mindset, geo politics and play a role, but that's really the problem. they no longer want to work in the realm of jail. politics of it, gentlemen, i'm going to interrupt myself because we're going to go to a break. and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on europe. same starting. the

russian states never as tight as one of the most sense community best, most all sense and the speed, the one else holes. question about this, even though we will fan in the european union, the kremlin media mission, the state on russia to day and split the smooth net keeping our video agency roughly all the band on youtube. the question, did you say stephen twist, which is the

as long as will just be original. ok to be in that room, but here i am rolando quito, pen alamo. but my father, patrice emory le moon, but 1st prime minister of the democratic republic of the congo dedicated his life to africa's true liberation. the colonialists care nothing for africa. for her own sake. they are attracted by african riches, and their actions are guided by the desire to preserve their interest in africa against the wishes of the african people. for the colonialist all means are good if they help them to possess these riches, these are my father's words spoken decades ago. yeah, they remain just as relevant today and the struggle for independence was not just

about raising the flag. it was about claiming africa's future free from foreign control, but let us ask ourselves, are we truly frequent? the western powers under new disguises, still seek to dictate africa's fate. they left through the front door of colonial rule, only to sneak back into the windows of economic exploitation and political interference . look at the democratic republic of the congo. my father fought for it. sovereignty even today for an interest. few instability in conflict just to maintain control over our vast and mineral well, the west justifies its interference with talk of democracy and human rights. but their real concern is never the african people. it is what lies beneath our soil. this is why africa must remain watchful. thank you for another solution for i will see you next time to if you're on our tea the

welcome back across. ok, we're all things are considered on peter lavelle to remind you were discussing europe the ok. let's go back to daniel daniel, you know, reading the european press in and politico, europe, particularly europe is preparing for war. why aren't they preparing for peace? why and say preparing for diplomacy. all we hear, you know, we have the most dangerous german chancellor and office since adolph hitler. i mean the kind of things coming out of his government is terrifying and it shouldn't come from berlin. daniel, well, i think one of the reasons is because their economies are crumbling. i mean, if you look at it germany, i think i saw a figure earlier today that there is a 11 percent increase in, in large corporate bankruptcies in 2025. and this being,

i think, a 3 year pattern and will continue germany has with his own he can nomics wrote in its determination to defeat russia in a war without going to war and everything is completely failed. and so now what are they doing? i mean, you had a high chance that murtz to get permission to massively increase the debt and all that spinning will be going to the war machine. and the even said, i think it was last week. he will do everything when within his power to prevent the restarting of north stream. so basically you'll do anything holding. okay, good. the bad, you know, for i was, i'm glad you brought that up. so he is with, was set this up here because this is where we need psychology. is it the new german chance or the most unpopular chancellor since the 2nd world war? and he was begging europe to tie his own hands. not allowing the opening of north stream. i mean, what kind of psychological mindset is that he wants the european union to damage

his country's economic prospects. explain that to us, daniel. well, a lot of people think it's because of his backup background in black rock because that's what they specialize in destroyed assets, scoop them up, and then turn them into prov, break them up, and then turns them into prophets. maybe that's just in his dna, but it seems insane. please don't give us cheap gas. please don't give us cheap cats. we want to destroy our civilian sector so that we can build shiny new bonds. so we can to tackle russia and had it in the us as well. i'm sorry, we're not going to give you air cover for your plans to coalition of the willing inside you crane. know that still by the wayside. so it's, it's all, it, it's all the sure it's all, it's all the, it's a fantasy. well, you know, let's go to our guest in stock. com. is your country preparing for war with russia? i thought you had a long history of neutrality, but you didn't have to worry about the upcoming, your european war against russia. well, we, we did have a long history of neutrality, but now we, we all. yes, but we, we, we also had

a long history of dealing with russia and dealing with, with a brick and in russia. you have to remember that i think, uh, its back of back in the 17th century. and in the early 16 hundreds, you had the british russia company who were deeply involved in trying to put their people in place in the russian empire. and the swedish military was there, and they even got us the, a swedish, a swede, swedish brother to the den king elected star of restaurant, but who intervene. and of course, the british intervened. so, i mean that this is, that you have to remember the immense wealth that's hidden in russia has always been of interest to the other european powers. be it's sweet and especially the british. i mean, the british russia company have, have been active since,

i think 1593 trying to somehow metal in russia. that's a fair, it's, it's, we called to help ourselves when it comes to russia. so sweden, we have been, we have been at war with russia. we have been at peace with russia. and now we're probably going back to a hostility situation with russia. well, it's, uh, it's a personal circle, but how does it really feel like we okay, like i get the, the russo phobia coming out of the a brit and i get, that's long standing here. but where, where you live, what, what do you get out of this? it renewed hostility with the rest of the how, what's the national benefit, so that there is no national benefit for the individual suite of citizens. there is, however, a huge, a profit to be made from the swedish companies that are deeply involved and especially the military, industrial sector or sweden is quite advanced. and the volume berg family are

getting a new orders from nato countries on many of their weapon system. so it's, it's just, it's once again, it's a conflict driven by profit interest that's detrimental to the interests of the swedish and most european union citizens. it's a classic case of all the profit, the driven war based not on ideology, but uh, based on economics. yeah, well james, how many people in the u. k. want to how many, what percentage of the population the u. k. would agree to conscription, the new conscription a. oh, that's interesting. uh, almost none of the stuff stuff that i thought about that i the yeah. and yeah, he's absolutely right as well. i mean, the, the continued will, does not benefit the british citizen, but, you know, for us that is all the problems as well. you know, we've got life off which has had

a perennial rusher problem since the bolshevik revolution. it was the socialist groups on and see if that it was a top floor and kept out of power by a radical socialist inside. it took that off to the wall, lays the great light, the prime minister joined nights are helpful nights are. uh you know, uh someone who stones compared to how we would send us the golden prime minister. he really didn't know what to do with rupture, and the substances also be a union. and i think part of this is a, can you kind of just doesn't have a foreign policy agenda. like many countries, britain has not found its place in the world since the 2nd world war. and so now we have to start doing gesture politics like promising $15000.00 troops. it's not going to happen. britain's own falls, it's $56000.00. yeah, we're not sending, you know, 2 fifths of the military to ukraine is just no one to put up with that. well, you know, daniel, be the massive,

very sophisticated john strike against russia over the weekend. and by all accounts, there was western involvement in that, particularly in my 6 and the c i a, this was still intentionally trying to bring this closer to a potential new killer conflict. the, this is the new killer triad. do you don't touch that? you're not supposed to, that's why it was designed that way. is just to get a win against donald trump, where it's going to war that well, that's the problem. what's the religion that they've developed for themselves is donald trump, is the heretic now for all of his fault? and i think that he's handling the rescue printing very badly, partially because he's not getting information as we found out last week, when the news came out that the president putin's helicopter may have possibly been talking to by a drone and reporter as president trump. if he had heard this because president trump had just gone off about how crazy bruton was becoming launching all the

drones into ukraine and the journalist had, will had you, have you heard that this is what preceded it? and led to this. he said, no, i had no idea. this is a big problem. he's, he's approaching it wrong. but nevertheless, what happened after this attack, the drone attack that you referred to inside the subsequent attack on the kurt kurt bridge, is the president trump called president put in and they had an hour long conversation . i believe it was on wednesday. now that's a now similar to the europeans, you are not allowed to talk with satan hitler. and that's exactly what trump did. so he's driving them crazy. he's destroying their religion. and rather than we examined again as we started off the show, rather than re examine the tenants of their faith, their doubling own. yeah, well i max is there, is there a reverse gear here? are we just where we see this a slow motion train wreck is? is there any way to write the ship? sorry for mixed metaphors, of course,

or there's always time to write the shape. uh that's, it's just that, uh, i think the country united states is making a critical mistake, like, like the did during discounting style and a piece processor. there they are not basically not including everyone that needs to be included and see included in this the, the piece initiative must also be include the ukrainian government from, from the american side and the otherwise ukraine will feel that it's just basically a passive participant in this the end of the end, the final thing and this stuff that's missing if we're lacking diplomats who have some serious thinking behind what they're doing. the problem today is we have a diplomatic corps that are feeling a things that they don't know things. they're actually feeling things and they don't have peace. that's an operative goal. the operative goal right now seems to

have a continuous forever war because that's the right feeling. so i missed, i missed the old guard when it comes to statesman. and especially when it comes to diplomatic personnel, let's say for example, if you use your term who, if we had the old guard, we wouldn't have had this conflict in the ukraine at all. it would have been avoided in and that's would be. and then that's what would have happened, history shows that, you know, james, what is the popular sentiment in, in the u. k. to is, out of the back in the government and its aggressive past year towards russia. i mean, after all, the prime minister is a pre war pre pre war prime minister. that's how he's presenting himself. i saw this, i think that's 2 ways to look at this now. um the anamosa teacher, both russian citizens is practically 0. i mean, discrimination against russians in britain is 0 to the metropolitan police has

thought, you know, the britons won't cheat. prussian gas bills are going through the roof again, you know, we were talking about no stream out of the of that would be a huge boon to the economy. but again, i think, well, a lot of britain started on the stand just all these route pools is like what happy to kind of jump on the a political cause of defending new crime. but the problem is trying to get him political colors, was that there was inaccurate analysis and fox that came out of stopped our understanding overall shop and the few cried. and i think the, you know, most britton's understanding of the crime is quite weeks. there. is that you crime that they want to believe exists, which is quite far away from the reality, which is a shame. well, it is a, that's such a really good point because again, we're kind of in the area of pretending a fantasy. the because the, the west itself can it cannot contemplate that it has miscalculated and lost, and particularly to a country like russia. we talk about neo liberalism,

a lot russia, is it neo liberal? it's very conservative. j daniel, that's one of the, it's another issue. they hate about russia, it didn't adopt their policies that are ideology. daniel? well, that's exactly the problem as well. i mean, russia, it has to be to, is returning to a conservative family values to church to all of the things that the west the world wants to, the, the core principles of the west that the west is now of band and completely. and particularly in europe and so they see it returned to this in russia and the fuels, all of their fears of going back to the bad old days, which maybe the 4 of us here us just especially as my colleague mentioned, maybe the good old days and we had people like your head, schroeder, and we had berlusconi. it wasn't that long ago where we had actual statesmen who would challenge. yeah. well the issue they, there, they weren't that they weren't the greatest, but they're certainly better than what we have now. i'll take them, i'll take them, i'll take them. yeah, absolutely. alright gentlemen,

that's all the time we have when i think my guess and stop. com, cambridge, and, and lake jackson. and of course, i want to thank our viewers for watching us here at ortiz, the next time, remember, prospect rules, the the, is this, this, i guess the type of who you are paying political, it likes between whether the serving the atlantic alliance or the european consensus i guess it, i think that's, that's part of the fundamental tension for europe in resolving this for at some point i feel they need to think more about european defense rather than american global ambitions. the

at the task, it too much of the garage on the items robust short to come. boeing on, my gosh, let's get you joe knob moment solution here. discovery to was used to fucked. the correct one. so then also it will be sent me to console. read it to you, or that we're pretty sure it distorted the task history just for the rest of their subject and your washer cohen and i still remember that color was never mentioned or so that you put them in front of your products and use me. i was doing this almost as much as your computer, but that's a big deal for you like a business of buckle. yes. which will go to a partial. supposed people store, she spoke and then to you. this is new york. so i asked that you were just bush of sewell, the

videos. now, i noticed the when 2 days of personal order not to collect the bodies of ukraine. soldiers who died ukrainian parliament member reveals that the lensky is refusing to allow the bodies of 6000 of the fallen soldiers to be transferred back from russian territory to their homeland. despite of having been agreed upon during the recent, it's done, we'll talk also key of adopt legislation stipulating that i'm missing soldier can be declared that only 2 years after the conflict and the move sparks speculation that the wednesdays government is trying to avoid paying desperately with ease to the families of each colon, soldier is rarely opposition says prime minister benjamin netanyahu is sponsoring and arming.