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tv   Government Access Programming  SFGTV  February 5, 2019 9:00am-10:01am PST

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will maintain it for the life of the encroachment planning. and we have members here to answer technical questions an the developer is here to provide more detail and give a presentation. >> commissioner: all right. let's get that presentation. ms. o'brien. >> good afternoon. i want to thank the mayor's office and supervisor walton to helping sponsor the major encroachment project. the dogpatch plaza was con ve d veefd -- conceived of a plan for additional open space to be used by all and as part of the project on indiana street we decided to dedicate the in-kind improvements to build the public plaza. we had a series of meetings with different members including the dogpatch association starting in
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2014 and worked over the years to make sure we had input from community members to make sure the plaza is something that could be well utilized by the neighborhood. at this point in time we're affording the encroachment portion and with that i'll turn it over to a colleague to talk you briefly through the plan. >> thank you for your support. >> sf gov tv, we these the laptop, please. >> thank you. dogpatch art plaza has been a community effort with residential residents and businesses within the area.
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there's over 15 different businesses and owners of properties on the friends of dogpatch art plaza non-profit board. as well as the plaza is within the newly-formed dogpatch green benefit district created in 2015. this shows the end of 19th street prior to the development of the plaza. it's become a huge success. this is what it looks like during the day. normal day activities can continue while community members are and there's activated events in the space. to the left is the cresco company can access their parking lot and the noon cafe is available during activation. we can open up the space and
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allow for community meetings, various events and art displays, etcetera. it's been a great deal for community event. there's been the dogpatch art plaza block party and san francisco streets numerous times have been located within the dogpatches art plaza. the plaza is within the northwe northwest hill. and it uses an annual assessment on property and the funding sources are used for maintenance, capital improvements, transparency and operations. along with the friends of dogpatch art plaza, san francisco parks alliance and the green benefit district there's also the plaza program. we are the non-profit and the park's alliance with the dogpatch art plaza to promote
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streamline permitting for events an enhanced coordination for community programming and connecting the community with open spaces in the area. if there's anything further the public wants to know we have a website. thank you very much. >> commissioner: the $23,790 the city engineer came up with an annual cost, how is that derived? >> commissioner: that's paid for by indiana llc, correct? >> we did an assessment working with various people telling us what their thoughts were to keep the plaza maintained and 650 end in street is currently keeping
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the plaza maintenance ongoing. >> commissioner: so this will not go to the financial detriment of the green benefit district? >> correct. it's just an added layer within the larger neighborhood. it's responsible for maintenance by 650 end -- indiana llc. >> commissioner: it escalates over time? >> yes. >> commissioner: why isn't the subject instrument before us say that? i'll ask the city deputy city attorney. >> the idea behind the annual maintenance costs and having the engineer certify it is in case at some future point is the permittee is not living up to the obligations of the
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encroachment permit, we can require that the permittee come out of pocket two years' worth of annual maintenance cost and depos it that with the city and as long as they continue to do the work afterwards, we'll refund the money. if not we may be in a position where we have to hold on to it and use it for maintenance. i do not believe we have explicitly included a clause. >> commissioner: if this is supposed to go on for the life of the encroachment and insofar as everything gets more expensive every year, it's not the only one i think we have
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another one but if it's going on 75 years i guarantee it will be twice that much in 2090 or whatever. >> we can certainly add that to our template and have that included in the two before you today and all future ones. >> >> commissioner: maybe this is to the deputy city attorney malumet but if, god forbid, indiana street llc or their successor in interest, fails to maintain and it becomes a blight the revocation procedure those intersection 786 of the public works codes we amended last year? >> yes. the revocation process is spelled out in public works code section 786. >> commissioner: okay.
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all right. any public comment on item number 3? don't all rush up at once. okay, public comment is closed. deputy city attorney gibner can we forward this to the full board subject to an amendment i know you don't want to prepare on the fly we can introduce next tuesday the next board meeting? >> yes, or we may not need an amendment at all. we can just change the document. >> commissioner: change the encroachment draft agreement? >> correct. taking your direction. the department and office can change the agreement. >> >> that will work. is there a motion to send item
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three to the full board with recommendation? >> so moved. >> commissioner: moved by supervisor heaney. i'll take that without objection. congratulations, supervisor walton. i know they built it at risk. next item, please. >> clerk: item 4 the resolution granting permission to 1532 harrison street and the property owner of 1532 harrison street to occupy a portion of 12th street right-of-way conditionally accept offer of public improvements an dedicating them to public use and pending appropriate finding. >> commissioner: this is brought to us by the mayor and supervisor haney and mandelman. >> thank you to my co-sponsor
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for their leadership. this is an exciting opportunity we have with eagle plaza for any number of reasons. it's an area of the city where we are lacking open space and this is going to be bring critical space to the west soma neighborhood. we have a plaza that will be thriving and serve the residents as well as the broader community. it's also exciting to further the work done to pay homage to the lgbt leather community in west soma. the men and women of the leatherman community have played a critical role in the area in san francisco. this will help further the work we with the creation of the lgbtq leather cultural district.
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i'm anticipating what it will mean for the community and west soma neighborhood and thank you to the many community members and business owners and others who have gotten us to this point to be able to present this to the board. >> >> thank you. ms. lutske. >> thank you. these improvements are proposed by the developers, 1532 harrison, llc the major encroachment as well. the developer is seeking to occupy with the public pedestrian plaza on the two-lane roadway known as eagle plaza and will have improvements with land skyping and roadway three alignment from three lanes to
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two lanes with parking and crossing, lighting, a pole and electrical outlets. the developer will maintain the facilities for the life of the major incroachment and it's part of the plan commission in kind agreement and the developer has a presentation related to this project. >> commissioner: all right. let's see the presentation. >> good afternoon. i'm a project sponsor. thank you to the mayor's office and supervisor mandelman for helping and this came from the western soma community plan. the neighborhood has a large need for more open space for the neighborhood and so we felt like this location would be a great area to provide open space and
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provide a gathering space for the community. we started working and reaching out to neighbors in particular the eagle bar across the street and got together over multiple community meetings starting in 2014 meeting with neighbors and community members and felt it would be a great location to commemorate the lgbtq and leather district and it will be a gathering spot for the neighborhood and i'll turn it offer to a colleague to explain the details of the plaza. >> thank you very much. san francisco park and land.
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>> you can see on the map eagle plaza and sits in the entry way for the lgbtq and leather district the mayor recently made. through the community effort it has created a commemorative plaza. this shows the leather flag with the activated space. this is looking east down 12th street and the aerial view of
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the space being activated during a closed event. this is the design from the community on what they'd like to see for activation and seating. there's been great group members that have helped create the non-profit for the plaza. there'll be in charge of the maintenance and activation of the plaza. we've had numerous outreach events and going to multiple meetings and cultural meetings and friends of eagle plaza meetings spreading the word about the project at up your alley, folsom street fair and doyle alley for the past years.
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eagle plaza will spearhead the coordination and permitting process from the city. thank you for your support. >> commissioner: thank you. is there any public comment on this item? seeing none, public comment is closed. sorry, come forward. public comment is open. >> hello, everybody, thank you for having us and for the mayor supporting this initiate. i'm from san francisco eagle, alex motijo and we've worked
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with members of the community trying to make the space available for everybody. we have a lot of plans for the activation and commemoration of the leather community. it would be great to have your support. thank you. >> commissioner: thank you, next speaker, please. >> i'm john taylor. i worked on the project from the beginning and i am one of the landlords of the next street over. we don't have an area in our area to go quietly. we have two playgrounds five or six blocks away so it hit would be -- this would be the only area in the vicinity where people could have an open space
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and we'll have not only the financing we proposed, we will have that coming also. we've worked on this many years and i take care of the other flags so this is another historic thing we'd like to do. thank you. >> thank you. good afternoon. i'm rachel sullivan. i've been involved with the project since 2014. i've been an active member on the leather alliance board and a liaison for the leather and lgbtq cultural district and this project i've been on since 2014. with my background and being a
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single mother this is exciting because as a little girl in the filipino community we used to hang out in the area so to have a place with green space would be great and for other organizations involved i have reached out to the urban players and other family-oriented organizations. this hub is open for everyone. it's exciting to have green space in south market. thank you again for your time. >> commissioner: thank you. seeing no other members of the public, we'll close public comment and i think the questions i asked on the last item would have been the questions i asked on this item but they were asked and answered so supervisor haney, do you have
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a motion? >> a positive recommendation. >> commissioner: without objection, that's an order. >> commissioner: madame clerk, next and last item. >> clerk: an ordinance amending the planning code to allow medical cannabis dispensaries with approval from the planning department for medical cannabis dispensary as of january 25, 2015 for uses under the same condition and converting all other uses from applicable use thorse -- authorization programs allowing applications pending at the planning department to convert to medical retail uses with a minimum radius requirements. >> commissioner: this was at the full board and supervisor safai
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duplicated the file and referred this back with the conforming amendment. supervisor safai. >> quickly, as a full body we made amendments in the public health code that allowed more of a transition period. and we missed this particular language putting it in the land use code. we're making a simple agreement to bring parity to the public health code and planning code on page 4 and 5. we change the date from january 1, 2019 to december 1, 2019 so there's parallel nature in public health and planning code. >> commissioner: is there any public comment on the item?
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>> good afternoon. supervisor i'm arlen tren and activist in visitation valley. on behalf of our neighborhoods i'm here to oppose the use when two bayshore has been in operation only 65 feet away. from the begin there's been many barriers to properties for the residents. the state proposition 624 clearly shows the visitation was to empty these in the largely residential zone and where there are children and youth programs nearby. i even played the visitation fee but never received information. thanks to supervisor walton's letter i'll hand to you that
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also opposes the use as the m.t.d. since the brutal attack of grandma wong, supervisor walton has identified a temporary police location at 66 raymond. i have a text message from the victim's granddaughter to allocate it as a permanent police substation and provide more basic programs our residents need such as e.s.l. programs we haven't had the last 10 years. if i may, i'll read you the letter >> may i finish? there have been residents almost 40 years and want to use it as the permanent police substation. we want to add more services that meet the real needs of our diverse residents and hope you'll grant this wish in the
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year of the pig. thank you. >> commissioner: i will have someone get the letters. >> thank you. >> good afternoon, supervisors. my name is rob yost and i live at 355 first street in district 6. i'm here to voice comments in opposition to this amendment on behalf of myself and concerned home owners and residents in the particular condominium complex. specifically the opposition has target the minimum radius requirement for certain pending applicants and the statute as written and established in 2017 was clear on its face and
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prohibit as a parcel containing cannabis retail use from operating within 600 feet from another said establishment. it's a well written piece of legislation and unclear to 43 through the process why the rule needs to be amended or changed? i think it's reflect itch of all inputs and interest. back in 2017 as i understand from a news article i read the board of supervisors considered seven hours of testimony from members of the public. when that ordinance was passed, the board of supervisors could have exempts parties from the rule and the opposition is specific to the buffer rule and ask you request you reject it on
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that basis. thank you. >> commissioner: thank you. seeing no other members of the public on this item we will close public comment. public comment is closed. so around the two issues you raised, that's not what is before us today. this is a technical amendment to conform two pieces of the code that other piece of legislation went to the full board and received a vote. which you object to which i respect but the thing we're dealing with today is merely changing one date to conformity with another date in another section of law. with that supervisor safai, do you have a motion as to changing
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january to december. >> motion to accept the amendment as proposed from january 1 to december 31, 2019. >> commissioner: supervisor haney, without objection we'll send that to the full board way positive recommendation and we are adjourned. that's a substantive state that needs to be continued to our meeting one week hence. thank you. that will be continued to our meeting of february 11. thank you ms. major we are adjourned. .
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>> shop and dine the 49 challenges residents to do they're shopping with the 49ers of san francisco by supporting the services within the feigned we help san francisco remain unique and successful and rib rant where will you shop the shop and dine the 49 i'm e jonl i provide sweets square feet potpie and peach cobbler and i
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started my business this is my baby i started out of high home and he would back for friends and coworkers they'll tell you hoa you need to open up a shop at the time he move forward book to the bayview and i thinks the t line was up i need have a shop on third street i live in bayview and i wanted to have my shop here in bayview a quality dessert shot shop in my neighborhood in any business is different everybody is in small banishes there are homemade recess pesz and ingredients from scratch we shop local because we have someone that is here in your city or your neighborhood that is provide you with is service with quality ingredients and quality products and need to
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be know that person the person behind the products it is not >> madam chairman. at this time cgboc is called to order. there's a quorum roll call. larry bush, kristin chu, brian larkin, brenda mcnulty, jane natoli, bart pantoja, lauren post, alexander tonisson.
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item two, opportunity for the public to comment on any matters within the committee's jurisdiction that are not on the agenda. seeing there are no member of the public present, we'll go on to item 3, which is the election of the chair. >> i would like to nominate kristin chu as chair and larry bush as vice chair. >> i second that nomination. >> i like to nominate alex as vice chair. >> i will decline that nomination. [laughter] [indiscernible]
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>> please be sure to speak into your mic >> not at present. >> no thank you. >> this election happens yearly right? >> yes. >> i'm deputy city attorney. the election is traditionally held under our bylaws a the first meeting fiscal year, which is in july. in this case, miss mcnulty is stepping down as chair. bylaws call for us to elect a vice chair by this committee's action, you can waive the requirements of the bylaws. i should note that no members of the public are here. as of right now, we don't need it take my public comment after discussion by the committee members. >> is there -- would you like to
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vote? >> i have a question. since i don't know the candidates, i was going to abstain. i don't want to hurt whatever quorum is required for the vote. i don't want to stop the business of electing officers. >> this comes up quite a bit. we need five votes to be chair or vice chair. we need five of them. in terms of an abstention, our vice to committee members is even if it's your first meeting, you if feel comfortable, you can rely on the opinions of your colleagues. they've known these people. that's entirely your call, however. >> thank you. >> you're welcome. >> based on what she said, we'll have elections said in the beginning of the fiscal year, so in july. we got two meetings between then anow. there's going to be another opportunity to have this. >> or small correction, the
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committee has the right to defer election of a vice chair today until the next meeting because many of you are new. we have a chair today. you can choose to elect a vice chair at the next meeting in march or just wait until the new fiscal year in july. that is your option. >> the other thing to be aware of is larry bush term is up in july of this year. your term su is up too? >> actually point of correction. myself, i need to correct myself. ms. lane made a good point. i'm looking at the the agenda. item 3 says election of chair. it does not say election of officer. so thank you ms. lane for that correction. we can vote on the vice chair at
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the next meeting. >> i will vote on the chair then. >> i think the motion is modify for nominating kristin chu vice chair. >> is there a second? >> you'll need to vote please. if you all agree, are there any abstentions? >> we all agree on the nomination to elect kristin chu as chair? >> aye. >> so approved. item 4, approval with possible modification of the minutes of the november 19, 2018 meeting.
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>> i move to approve. >> second. >> i should note for the record, i believe there are no members of the public here. no need to take public comment at this time before you vote. >> so the committee has approved the minutes? >> yes. >> item 5, presentation from public works regarding the 2016 health bond and possible action by the committee in response to such presentation. >> gorggood morning madam chaird
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member of the cgboc. i'm i' joe chin. i'm also joined today with members of the public works project management team and also i see chief rivera from the fire department in support of the bond program and address any questions that i may not be able to address in my presentation. with that said, just a quick update, my last formal presentation to cgboc was augus. the team has been submitting quarterly reports to cgboc last submittal was november of 2018. as part of this presentation, we also submitted a january quarterly report for the public
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health and safety bond program. let me move on to slide number two. for some of the newer members, i can give a quick overview of the bond program. this is the public health and safety bond program passed in june of 2016. it provides funding for three client department spread across six components. the departments include department of public health, the san francisco fire department as well as the department of homelessness in support of housing. of the $350 million which was approved for this bond program, $272 million is ilindicated toi- allocated to the department of public health. ly zuckerberg building 5 for the fire department, it was allocated $58 million with two projects or two components. first component is the ambulance
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deployment facility and second is the neighborhood fire station component. in the third is the department of homelessness in support of housing, $20 million was wasallocated for homeless service site. just a recap for this bond program, we've completed two bond sales to date. the first bond sale provided funding for all these components. bond sale number two, which was completed last year, was for two components. those two components are fully funded from the bond at this point. moving on to slide 3, this is executive summary over the entire bond program. the team in general has been
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advancing all projects across all components moving from programming to design and into construction. this gives you a highlight somee accomplishments in the past few months. the zuckerberg building five component, we have four projects in construction. under the zuckerberg building five, there's 19 core projects we've been tracking. of the 19 we have 15 projects active. we're working on various phases of the project lifecycle, either in programming, design, construction or closeout. of the 15 active projects we have four in construction and there's 11 that's currently active. then on the community health centre, on the maxine hall health centre, we are actually we won't to bid in december of
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2018. we received five bids and we're currenting in the bid award phase. which allow us to start construction by summer of 2019. on the similar balance deployment facility, we have awarded a construction contract to s.j. amoroso that was awarded in the latter half of 2018. notice to receipt has been issued. on the homeless service site, we have 440 turks street, which is currently in construction with a target completion date of summer of 2019 as well. the next slide i'll be focused, more drilling down on each of the components. first up is zuckerberg building five component.
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i want to mention that on this component, one of the first projects that we worked on that was completed is urgent care clinic. i'm happy to report that this project has been licensed, we have an opening ceremony that's been scheduled for februar february 12th. we mentioned two other projects in construction is the rehabilitation department relocation project. we have encountered some schedule extension. they are primarily driven by unforeseen conditions and oshpd code requirements. we are targeting to finish that
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project by second quarter of 2019. on the slide just pointing you to the lower right hand corner, there's some recent construction photos just to highlight what we're doing. 6h surge space is in process of finishing up the dry wall. things are closed out, which is in line with our completion date. rehabilitation project is just starting in certain areas. we're starting has ma hazmat mal and abatement. that's one of the major tasks to remove all the hazardous material.
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third project i want to quickly mention is the seismic upgrade, phase 1. phase 1 is what we call a subset of the larger seismic upgrade project. we o isolated 20 to 30 locations which is vacated in building five. we're going in and proceeding with the seismic scope which includes saw cutting and separating beam beams from colu. we're doing some column strengthening through a fiber wrap to strengthen columns and also to do some enlargement of columns. that's what we call phase 1 of that project. building five component, we advertised a request for
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provocation and r.f.q. to hire a general contractor -- a construction manager, will be called cgmcp it's an agreement method that allow us to bring on contractor to agree with public works and public health and work out the details needed to deliver the project. for this r.f.q., we're intending bundle eight projects that will be included under the larger project. that's moving along. we had our orientation meeting recently. we're expecting r.f.q. submittals by february 8ths. moving on to the southeast component. this is a component for public health. we are building a new health centre for d.p.h.
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it's a two story new health centre. we're currently in the design phase for this project. we are intending to complete the design by summer of 2019 then moving on to construction before the end of the year. other highlights, we did receive design review approval for phase 2 toward the latter half of 2018. we selected two artists a will be contributing to the public arts program for it building as well. this is the slide for southeast health centre. sorry. moving on to the other community health centres. this is really focused on two clinics that's under the d.p.h.
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network. maxine hall i mentioned earlier, we've completed the design. we have approval, we are currently if the award phase for this project. we're hoping to start construction by summer of 2019. one of the risk factors for this project is the need to relocate the clinic during construction. after various rounds of discussion with department of public health and the community and the district supervisor, we've identified a location for the clinic. we're working towards the procurement of the trailers and to get that installed. the start of construction for the maxine hall building project depends on the temporary clinic being set up. just quickly on castro mission,
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that project is in design. we're intending to finish the design by 2nd quarter of 2019. and starting construction latter half of summer of 2019. kind of in summary, you can look at both southeast health centre and maxine hall and castro will pretty much have all three clinics in construction by end of 2019. whicmoving on to the balance deployment facility component, i mentioned earlier, the construction contract has been awarded to s.j. amoroso, d.p.h. was issued in october of 2018. the construction was also anticipated to start in january.
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i'm happy to report that, w. of the first tasks on the construction side is the driving program that got started last week. that's the kickoff construction activity for the project. for those that aren't familiar with the facility, this is a brand new facility for the emergency medical services. i don't know all the details but, kathleen is here to explain better. this is essentially restocking facility for all the ambulances. it's not meant to be deployed. it's place where all the ambulance can come back and restock all their supplies and they get deployed from their locations throughout the city. moving on to the neighborhood fire station component. this component is focused on two main scopes. one is the seismic host tower
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removal project at six locations. six fire stations -- in the second scope is the generated replacement project at fire station 18. i know there's other locations that may have a potential if there's funding available for additional general replacement projects. for now, we know for sure station 18 is included as the generated replacement scope. other than that, seismic host tower project schedule, has been driven by the entitlement process. we got clarifications from the planning department. we're moving toward an interpretive approach that allow
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us to get past the entitlement project and get to a category exemption which will allow the project to start construction. at this point, design is in progress to be completed by end of year with construction to starstart in early part of 2020. for the january project, little bit ahead because there's no entitlement process there. we focus on finishing design that should be complete by marc. then also allow construction to start by the end of the year as well. now moving on to the last component of the program. this is for the homeless service sites. there's three projects that we're focused on. first is 440 turks street.
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it's going to be the administrative office as well as client access point for the department of homelessness and supportive housing. we're using that to deliver the project, construction. demolition has been completed as of november. we're working on a building permit and once we get the permit it will allow us to proceed into the renovation. we're currently anticipating that to be february of next month. construction completion date for 440 turk street is 2019. the other project that we have tracking under homeless service sites is the what we call the client city-owned shelters. the three locations have been identified as part of this
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project scope, it's 1001 hope street and 525, 5th street. once we have the scope of work, that will allow the design to proceed. currently we're anticipating design to start or kick off by the first quarter of 2019 for the shelters. the last project, i will go through is 1064-68 missions. this is a multi-agency project which includes the mayor office, housing community development and d.p.h. and department of public health. it's funded by the bond program it's creating a centralized
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deployment office as well as client access point for the san francisco homeless outreach team. that's currently also in design with construction to start by early part of 2020. that's the components. the last slide i have for this morning is the overall expenditure for the bond program. expenditure generally has been low but obviously for these capital projects driven by construction. you can kind of focus on ambulance deployment facility. you can see the total bond budget is $48 million and currently we've encountered $30 million. majority of that isallocated to the construction that project.
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i anticipate the maxine hall under the community health centre component to have uptick of expenditure. that will be the same for other clinics as well. at this point, that ends my formal presentation to cgboc, myself and my team are available to answer any questions that yu may have. >> thank you. one of the ways that we organize ourselves at cgboc, we adesign individuals on this group to different bonds. this one happens to be the bond that i'm assigned to. i work with joe prior to these meetings to go over the status of what's going on. after his presentation, i let you know about my findings. for the new members, what i'm looking for specifically in the governance of this bond is two
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things. one is this bond being managed in a financially responsible way? the second one is the bond meeting the expectation of the voters? i will talk about both of those to give you an idea what things i used to determine those things. regarding is the bonding managed in a financially responsible w way. when it comes to the cgboc side of the job we do, only stick that we have the ability to stop a bond from issuing bonds. the issuance of bonds happens well before the projects a really well under way. it's important to know early on whether the bond is heading in a fiscally responsible way. what you use to do to make that decision is the audits that are
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done. the city services auditor -- they'll talk about the work that they do -- later on there's a mid-year update from the audits and project group from the auditor. the last slide talk about the planned 2016 public health and safety audit. that is a financial one. that is to determine whether bond revenues are spent in according to the bond measure. this is a way for us to have confidence in it. i'm not an expert in the numbers at this level. that's their job. this is scheduled for this. what i noticed, this is scheduled for this fiscal year. in the back of our packet, there's a memo from the controllers office public finance about our upcoming
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issuance. i want to see that before they issue that. i also did little math. i now that we issued two bonds for the public health already that add up to $225 million. this next issuance is the last issuance of the 350 total. for me, that's okay, this is it. this is an important issue for us from a governance body perspective. having said that, i don't have any concerns. i'm trying to explain what is in our purview. the other thing that is a bond meeting expectations of voters. i really do mean that when we go to the ballot and we vote for these bonds what information have we used to make that decision? what do i think will happen? is my homeless shelter going to get upgraded? do i have that expectation? have they been clear?
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i find this bond in particular extremely difficult to cover. i've said this every time. i think that the way that it was written and presented to the voters was unfair to us as voters. it's six different programs within those programs, it's many projects. little projects, big projects, all kinds of stuff. i don't know how the voter could have known knowing what they'll get. it's also some of the -- because there's so little and they weren't completely understood when we voted for them. there's decisions being made at the client level about what to do. should we do this one or that one. i think that's not fair to the voters. certainly not something joe or the fire department or mayor's office air department of public
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health can change. it's something i find very difficult to do. the other thing i want to point out, joe works for the department find publi of public. he's an uber project manager -- >> i thought you were going to say driver. [laughter] >> he's working on behalf of the client department. one of the things i think the question of do the client department feel like they're getting the services that they expected. i do want chief river rivera to comment on that. beyond that, i think it's very hard to go back to the voters, particularly on this one and say, we closed up the general rebuild. that was pretty clear what they were doing. joe manage

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