you don't usually hear perry mason moments. this seemed like a perry mason moment. the judge is going to have to judge this, make a decision on whether this guy has any credit built at all. hinkley's lawyers moved to have all the testimony thrown out. the government contested that and will argue that at some.down the road. it is going to be interesting to see what the judge does. >>> thanks bruce. >>> a woman is dead after an accident in an elementary school parking lot. police say a maintenance worker driving a school van must have backed over the woman. she died at the scene. it happened this morning at samuel chase elementary in temple hills. neighbors call it a tragedy. >> it is a sad thing to know. >> a couple of guys doing their job, trying to make a living every day, and a tragic accident happens that i'm sure they feel responsible for, and you know, there is a person that is dead. tragic all the way around. >> police say the woman has no ties to the school. police have not yet released her name. >>> investigators are trying to figure out what sparked a fire

>> it was just a perry mason moment. >>> coming up -- >> we were together all the time. >> tom foley on the stand with his own fate on the line. >> i wanted to convince the police. i wanted to convince my wife's family. >> could he? when "dateline" continues. hey, it's me -- water. when i think about how lucky i am that i've had a pur water filter remove 99% of lead and microbial cysts... [ sniffs ] and then i think about the water that hasn't. [ whimpers ] i ju...i don't know. it doesn't seem fair. but do you really? [ female announcer ] neutrogena® makeup remover erases 99% of your most stubborn makeup with one towelette. can your makeup remover do that? [ female announcer ] neutrogena® makeup remover. [ male announcer ] that onion after taste after you again? new crest complete with scope dual blast technology blasts away bad breath germs and food after tastes. new crest complete with scope dual blast. blast your way to fresh breath. it also cleans leather, gives a luster to laminate, stainless, even granite. today, pledge shines more than end tables. [ female announcer ] sc joh

we've had perry mason on the program. >> reporter: and hillary clinton, she was -- >> she was an alternate. >> reporter: the questions that mac and altman productions comes up have questions that can stump the students that we kont see or hear. >> sometimes you can hear a four-letter word that has to be excised. >> reporter: technology has changed the way students learn and communicate. and the questions always have to keep up with the times. >> the major difference is the information technology, it was not available 50 years ago. >> reporter: mac's 85 now. and getting over a stubborn sinus infection. but like a fine wine, his sense of humor gets better with age. his favorite answer -- >> the question was, who defeated napoleon at waterloo? this kid very eagerly said, duke ellington! >> reporter: with confidence. >> yes. >> reporter: among his favorite days with wrc, radio. a drive time announcer in the big band era. interviewing some big names. >> i would select them. and i would go up and interview them. ♪ >> reporter: he still comes back to nbc 4 every week with former colleagues to l

a lot of us grew up watching "perry mason." you don't see those kinds of movies now it seems to be almost seasonal that you have, you know, either positive or negative portrayals. but it seems to follow a certain cycle. we have so many shows on tv now about, you know, police and law enforcement. i think we have, what, maybe three different "c.s.i. i "series now, "law & order" parts one, two, and three. what do you think counts for the portrayal of our justice system and how it shifts over time? and also if you've seen in terms of what writers have done or haven't done. >> you know, i was -- when i was listening to mr. serra, i was thinking, you know, actually the law is this huge thing. and there are parts of it that work really well. and when i started out, i was a young lawyer at a large wall street law firm. and believe it or not, we did really good work. and since we typically litigate against or are involved with other large corporate law firms, the other people did railly good work. and since we were typically in federal

>> we had astronauts on the program, john glenn and perry mason. >> reporter: hillary clinton, she was -- >> she was an alternate on "it's academic" from chicago. >> reporter: the questions that they come up with every week can stump students in ways we don't always get to see or hear. >> you can see the distress when they don't and sometimes you can hear a four-letter word that has to be excised. >> reporter: technology has changed the way students learn and communicate and the questions always have to keep up with the times. >> the major difference is that information technology was not available 50 years ago. >> reporter: mac's 85 now and getting over a stubborn sinus infection. like a fine wine, his sense of humor gets better with age. >> the question was, who defeated napoleon at waterloo and this kid eagerly said, duke ellington. >> reporter: with confidence! >> yeah. >> reporter: among his favorite days with wrc, radio, a drive-time announcer in the big band era, interviewing big names. >> i would select them and i would go up and interview them. >> reporter: he still comes back

you don't get very many perry mason moments, real life ones in the courtroom. here, we almost did. the defense attorney really took this guy apart. he had to admit that he had the wrong date, the wrong time. hinkley wasn't even in williamsburg, then, we are going to have much more on this at 6:00. >> we'll look forward to it bruce, thank you. >>> meantime a former cia age from arlington is being accused of leaking classified information to the media. he is accused of sharing classified information with a new york times reporter about al qaeda interrogations. the 47-year-old has been ordered released on a $250,000 unsecured bond. if convicted, he could face decades in prison and a fine of up to a million dollars. leslie? >> reporter: plans are taking shape tonight to honor joe paterno. the former head of the penn state football program died sunday morning after battling lung cancer. our scott broom joins us now live. scott? >> reporter: the outpouring of grief continues here today. so does that bitter ernesto toward the university's board of regents. the challenge right now is how t

john glenn, perry mason on the program. >> reporter: and hillary clinton, she was -- >> she was on from chicago. >> reporter: the questions mac and altman productions come up with every week can stump students in ways we don't always get to see or hear. >> you can see the distress when they go -- sometimes you can hear a four-letter word that has to be excised. >> reporter: technology has changed the way students learn and communicate and the questions always have to keep up with the times. >> reporter: the major difference is that the information technology is not available 50 years ago. >> reporter: mac's 85 now and getting over a stubborn sinus infection but like a fine wine his sense of humor gets better with age. his favorite answer? >> the question was, who napole >> reporter: okay. >> this kid very eagerly said duke ellington. >> reporter: and with confidence. >> yes. >> reporter: among his favorite days with wrc, radio, a drive time announcer in the big band era interviewing some big names. >> i would select them and go up and interview them. ♪ >> reporter: he still comes back

. >> it was perry mason. >> you never saw it coming. it was something else. this was about a claim he made in a super pac ad. >> governor romney's super pac has put an ad out there suggesting that i voted to allow felons to be ail to vote from prison. i would ask governor romney, do you believe people who have, who are felons, who served their time, who have extended, exhausted their parole and probation, should they be given the right to vote? >> governor romney? >> first of all, as you know, the pacs that run adds on various candidates -- >> we're looking for an answer to the question, first. [ applause ] >> this is martin luther king jr. day. this is a huge deal in the african-american community. >> i don't think people have committed violent crimes should be allowed to vote again. that's my own view. >> in the state of massachusettsings when you were governor, the law was that not only could violent felons vote after they exhausted their sentences, but they could vote while they were on probation and parole. which was a more liberal position than i took w

ththe poinint is this -- perry had his chance in iowa, in the debates. the most memorable line he has tered has been "oops." he has not succeeded, and he will not sceed in south carolina. i am not sure why he is going other than thahat he has aot of money and some hope.e. it looks as if it will be a consensus candidate who will oppose romney, it t will be santorum. >> on npr, we had a piece of tapepe this week where r rick santorum was talking by john f. kennedy and d hiseetingng with the baptist minists, and he said thathen he read it, it made him want to throw up. that is the kind of thing that will not play well for santorum. >> i think that t in addition to the "oo" line from rick perry was his line on the sunday talk shows where his campaign had a lot of bumps and grinds along the way. [laughter] >> romney -- there is nobodyho can beat him. that is the rereality. >> nexext week we will taalk about new hampshire. thatat is the last rd for this week. thanks. see you next wk.

i'm with the washington masonic temple, and that is it. that is my membership. the point is this -- perry had his chance in iowa, had his chance in the debates. the most memorable line he has uttered has been "oops." he has not succeeded and he will not succeed in south carolina. i am not sure why he is going, and that he has a lot of money and he still has hope. it looks as if it if there is going to be a consensus candidate who will oppose romney, it will be sent to a room. >> -- it will be santorum. >> on npr we had a piece of tape this week when rick santorum was talking about john f. kennedy and his meeting with the baptist ministers, and he said that when he added, it made him want to throw up. that is the kind of thing that will not play well for santorum. >> i think in addition to the "oops" line from rick perry was his line on the sunday talk shows were the said that his campaign has had a lot of bumps and grinds along the way. [laughter] >> romney is a vulnerable because he is not one of their guys, but there is no other. there is nobody who can beat h

i'm with the washington masonic establishment, and that is it. that is my membership. [laughter] the point is this -- perry had his chance in iowa, had his chance in the debates. the most memorable thing he uttered was "oops." with the south carolina, i am not sure what is going other than that he has a lot of money and some hope. it looks as if there is going to be a consensus candidate who will oppose romney, then it would be santorum. it is hard to imagine anybody else imaging right now. >> we had take this week when santorum was talking by john f. kennedy, the meeting with baptist ministers, and he said that when he read, it made him want to throw up. that is the kind of tape that will not play well for santorum. >> colby? >> in addition to the "oops" line, there was his line on the sunday talk show where his campaign had a lot of bombs an8 -- bumps and grinds along the way. [laughter] >> there is really know what you can beat him in. that is the reality. >> they keep searching and searching. >> daniels on the bench, paul ryan sitting on the bench, chris christie d

mason, republican. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i am a marine corps veteran and graduating in the spring with a bachelor's and political science and i keep hearing from people that mitt romney is i've been crammed down our throats or biebelsheim he is simply getting their votes -- is being crammed down their throats or he is simply getting the votes because he is the guy who can beat obama. but 25% across the nation -- believing that room is the right man. we believe in america and mitt romney. i think he is under appreciated in this race. got endorsements. ann coulter, who is very conservative and chris christie, who i think could make a great vice president of candidate. i think he has a message to -- that could compete with president obama. host: do you think he will gain more traction in the coming weeks? caller: i think he will do well in new hampshire and across the northeast in general. there are a lot of pennsylvania is that i talked to like him. host: we will hear from former pennsylvania governor tom ridge a letter of the

expressed purpose of trying to take down mitt romney below the mason-dixon. all three of them believe they can compete much better in the south against what they call now a massachusetts moderate in mitt romney. jenna? jenna: all right, carl, stay around with us. jon, i believe we found another carl to bring into this conversation. jon: we'll have the karl twins with us. karl rove, former senior advisor to president george w. bush and a fox news contributor is with us now. mitt romney has in the words of one newspaper, dropped all pretense and said last night we're going to win this thing, meaning the iowa caucuses. do you see him positioned to do that? >> he could. he stepped back from the incident and said he was talking about the nomination. if you look at "real clear politics" average there have been six polls since christmas. mitt romney leads in five of the six. his lead though is very small. and the average of those six polls it is 22.8% to 21.5% for ron paul. rick santorum then in at 16%. but, it's very, it is too close to call. we have three contende