occupy was a breeding ground for violence and domestic terrorism thanks to a freedom of information act request by the partnership for civil justice fund we now know that the occupy movement was a favorite target of the f.b.i. even before the movement got off the ground going all the way back to august two thousand and eleven a month before the occupation of zuccotti park even began the f.b.i. in new york was notifying bankers and business owners of a pending threat against them even though from its inception occupy has always been a movement aimed at bringing about political and social change through peaceful nonviolent action. this early threat was just the beginning and hundred twelve heavily redacted pages handed over by the f.b.i. we can start to piece together a massive surveillance operation conducted against the occupy movement and its participants by the f.b.i. and the department of homeland security working with local law enforcement for the protection of corporate america and it wasn't just on wall street occupy encampments in indianapolis milwaukee memphis richmond jacksonvi

occupy was a breeding ground for violence and domestic terrorism thanks to a freedom of information act request by the party. movement was a favorite target of the f.b.i. even before the surveillance operation conducted against the occupy movement and its participants by the f.b.i. and the department of homeland security working with local law enforcement for the protection of corporate america and it wasn't just on wall street occupy encampments in indianapolis milwaukee memphis richmond jacksonville and even freakin anchorage alaska were put under watch by the f.b.i. and described in internal memos as potential domestic terror threats but why did the f.b.i. consider a movement comprised of students senior citizens mothers with baby carriages and americans of all colors and backgrounds such a threat especially when time and time again confronted by police brutality occupiers didn't fight back or abandon their commitment to nonviolent resistance they sat there peacefully taking a dousing of pepper spray to the face or a nightstick to the stomach or in the case of marine vet scott olsen

the documents you got under the freedom of information act. we are talking to mara verheyden-hilliard who is the executive director of the partnership for civil justice fund, which got the documents under the freedom of information act and has been trying to get them for the past years. we will be back in a moment. ♪ [music break] >> "i'm tired, i'm tired, i'm tired" by marva whitney. marva whitney, as we turn, died this weekend at the age of 68. we go back right now to mara verheyden-hilliard, executive director of the partnership for civil justice fund the released documents showing how the fbi monitored occupy wall street. i want to turn to one of the documents. this is "democracy now!," democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. part of a memo from the at the ipods field office from jacksonville, florida. the document is titled "domain program management domestic terrorism." is shows the fbi was concerned the occupy movement -- areascument cites certain of concern in central florida where -- you talk

they got the list from the freedom of information act. >> eric: dumb question. why go through the freedom of information act to find out who had a handgun and not find out who is a sexual predator. newspapers don't post anything like that. >> bob: whether they do or don't they got it legally. this guy is supposedly, if he has a gun in his house he wants everyone to know about it so he is safe and immune from all crime. ridiculous. >> eric: true. >> bob: ridiculous. i wait for the 2 million people every year to save themselves. >> andrea: david gregory got in trouble because he held up a gun magazine on one of the shows to try to prove a point. a lot of people are reporting hi could go to jail for this. can i say something? this shows how insane the gun laws are in d.c. are we really scared of law law-abiding citizen david gregory with a >> kimberly? going to jail for holding it up. case and point how the nutso gun control advocates -- >> bob: not going to jail. >> greg: he thought it was people magazine. >> bob: get out of here. >> greg: i want to make a point o

of information act is a federal law that establishes the right to obtain information from government agencies so who can file a request. much anyone that includes u.s. citizens private organizations and foreign nationals exemptions of course can apply to certain parts of the government but on the whole these requests serve as an important tool to keep those in charge accountable it's also pretty simple to file just go online fill out your name your address and your ego question seven ask you for what information you want access to and from where in order to keep track of the documents you ask for question eight ask you what key phrases in particular you are interested in order to narrow down your search results sort of like a library catalogue then a couple of questions about money in payment for the surgeon there you go you have successfully filed a formal request with the u.s. government but while filing those requests might be as easy as one two three getting an answer to your questions is the tricky part during twenty eleven over six hundred forty four thousand to four across wer

no freedom of information act request had until we discovered that account, had they ever searched her private e-mail accounts that she was using for public business. essentially he is was evading federal law -- she was evading federal law by concealing what should be open and transparent deliberations overall these extremely expensive rules that the epa has been firsting on our economy. tom: nobody likes washington covering up anything but there are published wants that maybe he is is not the first baby -- she is not the first, and maybe carroll browner was involved in this, this may have gone on in bush administration, bush 43. is this -- do you know anything about these accusations or reports? >> it was said during the clinton administration that carroll brander did not use e-mail. but we discovered, my colleague horner discovered that carroll brander did, when the clinton administration left they destroyed hardwares that the e-mail was contained owe can't look back at shenanigans that cheryl branner was getting up on the clinton administration. and now they are turning over approxi

so, let's -- i am going to put it in the freedom of information act request for obama's diary. maybe the diary itself is a gsa notebook or something like that so they cannot, exception, obviously, if not going to get it. i worry what we do not know. i am sure it is larger than what we do think we know. >> about? >> about -- anything. him. what he is doing. what is driving him. who is barack obama? >> one question -- about to get the hook. we will do this very quickly. you were talking about -- the president is a man of mystery. if you are a little bit of a man of mystery to yourself. everyone in this room is a fascinated about how you do what you do. one time he told me about how you reached a general who would not take your call. >> if would not take the call. would not be interviewed. it was a key general on the fourth george bush book. i found out where he lived. what is the perfect time to go visit a general at night? 8:15 because they would have eaten if they are home. there are a couple of extra hours. so, i knocked on the door without an appointment. if he opened the doo

freedom of information act request during a war in iraq and iraq in. surgeons found novel ways to make old weapons like new these photos show troops in iraq playing around with some do it yourself rocket launchers including one that uses a person's head as the launching pad shorter believe the photo is from two thousand and nine an improvised rocket launchers used parts from russian made rockets taken from saddam era stockpiles iraqi militants are the only ones playing with playing macgyver with any weapons they can get their hands on arms specialists have seen similar ingenuity coming from libya in syria and there's more news from syria today the federal register including the syrian rebel group jots all nusra on its list of terrorist organizations the state department said the job at all nusra has ties to al qaeda and there's no question that it is using some of the same tactics the rebel group has taken credit for multiple suicide bombings in syria targeting the government of bashar al assad now in the state department determines that a group is a t

after a freedom of information act was requested by truthout reporter jason leopold and the partnership for civil justice local law enforcement officials have teamed up with the f.b.i. and homeland security in order to deal with the occupy movement what's more the f.b.i. actually invokes the term domestic terrorism when referring to nonviolent protesters in the occupy movement essentially confirming the movement organizers when they're saying that the political policing was happening across the country joining me now to break down this information coming out of this foyer request as independent journalist and out activist and only just militia heather ana so first things first we already knew that the occupy movement was being closely monitored by the government but what i formation is coming out about the surveillance of the movement that we're learning now from the foyer request. well we're learning basically that jason lee is full of good make this request during the movement and as she has not and it was not granted and now it's coming out that there is a essentially lied about that

freedom of information act request and that's correct and i think you know it should have been transparent and upfront and we should be able see what the fed has on their balance sheet i know the fed is coming out and saying one thing but they're doing another thing which is a little bit. dangerous when you have massive amounts of money flying around the recent interview with a congressman asking the chief inspector of the fed what about this nine trillion dollars where it has this money gone and the inspector said we're investigating this on a high level but we don't know who that money was lent to right now and we'll get back to you then if you place a lot of us roll back for a second because ok i understand that they need more transparency the fed is being disingenuous they're doing things under the under the the shadow banking system but the size of the shadow banking system itself that was is so huge that it's bigger than the global g.d.p. and so that having this like having a parallel planet orbiting earth death star you know almost it's not get too dramatic here but it's an enormous

of information act request an interesting thing to find out if we actually had real promise at a time do you have any idea michael of what these contracts are bases are like as compared to what regular military bases are like well i lived in a fog like i said i was in the the international zone formerly called the green zone in baghdad but i was on many many favs all around the country and i would venture to say they probably are very very much very much the same hesco barrier walls you know out in the middle of nowhere or on a piece of land i should say we are near the airport here in kabul probably a bunch of his co walls probably a bunch of t. walls probably didn't take much to build and then trailers prefab trailers with electrical and plumbing basic plumbing and internet cable yeah ok not a lot michael o'brien the author of the mail of america's a failure in iraq thanks as always for being here and sharing either insight great thanks for having me. well i want to talk now about an interesting thing that happened here in washington yesterday a vote taken by the u.s. senate to rati

according to documents obtained through americans for limited government freedom of information act request 20 of those employees work for the national air traffic controllers association with 8 of them making more than 170,000 dollars a year and only three of the 35 make less than 100,000 a year. the lowest earner among them made almost 81,000. the study by heritage foundation said the average air traffic controller compensation is expected to rise towards 200,000 in the last five years. the average american makes 50,000 a year and average dot employee makes 70,000. federal employee unions aren't legally allowed to negotiate compensation but they can bargain on other working conditions through out the federal government and departments and agencies are obligated to pay career employees who payoff fish shall time performing union duties. the department of transportation paid more than $15.4 million in those in 2010. that's compared to 12.5 million in 2009. we don't know where it is now but pretty fair guess it is hire than that. also looking to look at cutting spending. >>> thank you very m

is the freedom of information act request that was filed by josh bernstein local law enforcement officials teamed up with the f.b.i. and homeland security in order to deal with the occupy movement what's more the f.b.i. actually invoked the term domestic terrorism when referring to the nonviolent movement the centrally confirming movement organizer accusations that police that took a political policing tactics when they were arresting occupy protesters and depended journalist an activist an elitist miller join me earlier to break down the information coming out of this boy request and here's my conversation with her well we're learning basically that jason the as good make this request during the movement and as. a threat and it was not granted and now it's coming out that there is a essentially lied about that this surveillance is happening the whole time meaning that there were informants planted and at the occupy and a new york and around the country and that the f.b.i. at the department of homeland security were basically in partnership with. corporate america which is really really fr

there seems to be a vitality with whatever they are doing with the freedom of information act. i do not know it is the new found the experience for them, but the volume of material i have been coming across and british news accounts based on their foi processa is staggering. -- process is staggering. there are operations of foia at the state and local level. i have seen pretty dramatic change. the other thing i would say is that some of the technology advances are a mixed bag. i do not want hudson to take offense. some of the loss of focus on the white house's parts is that sometimes they get wrapped up in gee whi spentz of collaborative government and -- gee whiz aspects of collaborative government and they lose sight of other aspects of disclosure that would be soluble for reporters. i think there is a happy medium that can be achieved. some of the stuff being done in terms of technology is exciting and gymnastics. the two things have to go hand in hand. there is no point in having a collaborative process if the public does not have any idea of what is going on. what is going

, though requested under the freedom of information act, was not released. the map reveals names and addresses of people with permits but does not dis chloe if they have a gun. the data was requested by three counties but putnam county is working on gathering data. newspaper in a statement to fox foxnews.com explained the reason for publishing the information, the massacre in newtown remains top of mind for many readers and conversation on our opinion pages and web has been focused on gun control. readers are interested to know about guns in their community. >> david lee, this isn't the first time the paper did something like this. >> no, it's not. the newspaper published similar information about gun permits in 2006 but they said the reaction this time was much greater. that was due they said to the popularity of social media. this paper is owned by gannet and struggling economically. the journal news let newspaper eliminated staff. the article published this week provided an interesting footnote about the author. the paper said he owns a smith and wesson .

that's according to newly-released f-b-i internal documents released under the freedom of information act. they describe several instances where counterterrorism agents joined with other agencies to monitor protesters across the country. and prepared surveillance and precautionary measures. some civil rights groups are upset that the protests were viewed as criminal acts. the f-b-i says it recognizes the rights of groups to engage in peaceful protests, but must also deal with potential threat of violence. >> los angeles has moved up its annual gun buyback program in the wake of this month's shooting rampage in connecticut. people can drop off their guns in exchange for a grocery store gift card -- no questions asked. the mayor says the city's residents want to be proactive >> they want to act they're tired of waiting on congress and on legislators to do something. there is too much talk and not enough action this is an opportunity for people to act and get rid of guns they do not need. or do not use. all too often, the guns are stolen. >> the city destroys the guns it is given. since

the documents were released under a freedom of information act request from the partnership for civil justice fund. a spokesman for that group said the papers showed the government treated the protests as potential criminal and terrorist activity. the f.b.i. denied those accusations. >>> call it a christmas miracle in san jose. we'll show you how a baby's early arrival put the delivery in his father's hands. >>> the rain is out of the area right now. it's still snowing in the mountains, but there's more weather headed our way as we move through this week. i'll have the details on when you can expect more showers. >>> our san jose family has quite a christmas story to tell this year after their baby arrived earlier than expected. so early, in falk, the father had to deliver the baby boy. ktvu's dan reuben spoke with the parents today and joins us live with the parents' story. >> reporter: like many, the hi himings were all ready for christmas. they weren't ready for this. it was a gift therm not expecting this xngs, baby conner arrived two weeks ahead of schedule. >> it was due early j

i support the freedom of information act when which is the basis by which the newspaper got the names and addresses of these individuals that should not be trumped by common sense. there is absolutely no legitimate basis stated for the newspaper who have published this information. it's a danger to society. i believe there should be legal recourse. >> where is the aclu on this? very have they come out and said anything? >> i haven't seen the aclu. >> exactly. i support legislation that he is trying to get pass that would ensure in the future information contained on these gun permit applications remain private to me it's beyond irresponsible. this is agenda driven reporting. clearly intimidation tactic against anyone who is a lawful gun owner. that's a lawful act to own a gun. do you have a permit to do so. different types of permits in new york. lawful act. an act of pure intimidation. it is abominable. i hope people watching this make their views heard to this news journal newspaper and any advertisers that support it frankly i find it to be incredibly outrageous. go to this other c

of information act and found two documents where they had done scientific tests from their farms laboratory that can not negative. so this was another piece of manufactured evidence besides the manufactured witnesses and things like that. then there case fell apart. and 19 -- in 1985, the eighth circuit court of appeals judge asked the prosecutors just what was mr. peltier convicted up because we cannot find no evidence of first-degree murder in the record? the prosecutor stated the government does not know who killed the agents, nor does he know what for dissipation leonard peltier may have had. so in 1992, i filed an appeal again asking what i was in prison for the government does not know what i am here for. so they changed it to aiding and abetting, which is illegal because i was never indicted for it or prosecuted for it and it takes a whole different defense in the trial. ami don't know what the hell here for. >> how is your health? can you describe the conditions at komen? >> it is a united states penitentiary. they're getting worse and worse. were 20 or like they 30 years ago. i hav

you have an exemption under the freedom of information act, why the false identity and the unwashed masses know her public e-mail address and it's head of the environmental protection agency can be very difficult, but why the false identity. you can set up many things other than hiding your identity and 12,000 e-mails just discussing the war on coal. that's a lot. why the false identity is the question that continues to be begged and hopefully we can answer. >> there wasn't a regulation that she didn't like and she didn't want to impose. >> can the coal companies breathe easier now? can we see new power generation happening in this country or are we going get someone just like her because they'll want to work for president obama? >> right. here's the thing. she was hailed by rolling stone as the most progressive ep achieve ever, but at the end of the day she was effectuating a radical agenda set by the president. this war on coal was set forth when he gave his shellacking press conference and said there were other ways to skin that cat. so you're going to get somebody who wants the job to

the file a freedom of information act i can get it. >> you can get the information but not where it belongs. >> you want the government to know but no one else to know. people who own guns might be fearful of the government only having that information. there are people who want their firearms because they don't trust this government. stuart: i am out of time. come back and tell us how things are progressing. thank you for joining us. lots of economic numbers came out at the top of the hour. new home sales up 4.4% in november, month over month, up 4.4%, housing market the bright spots in the economy. pretty good news. >> you get the consumer confidence reading, it is discouraging. how do you explain, can you blame it on the fiscal cliff? we see unemployment numbers not breeding -- modeling a long and it is not adding up. that sentiment number should have been higher. a lot of people are saying it is truly recovered. stuart: we are down 4 points. >> doesn't make sense. stuart: president obama back in washington and the senate is back in session. harry reid is addressing the senate. this is d

so you file the freedom of information act . you can get all of the information publicly, the names and address but not the specific information. >> brian: a bloger decided to take matter in his own hands . he said we'll publish the names and addresses in the newspaper. and fighting fire with fire. >> i don't know that that is helpful to be honest. i would ask them the same question as people looking foget the information. what are you doing with the information? if you know your neighbor keeps gun. are you camping out to check them out and same thing with getting the name addresses of editor of . hey, do drive bys. all right. you are harass being people who have, we are looking to exercise our constitutional rights and they are exercising theirs and if i assert mine i have to respect theirs. >> julia: thank you. >> clayton: keep us updated . god forbid your name gets published. >> julia: we'll see if it spreads in the country. >> clayton: coming up. a major car maker firing a chaplain because he might offend someone. >> julia:

freedom of information act. >> if the fbi met with new york stock exchange officials and businesses in august to about 11 to one of a planned september protest. >> the fbi released a statement says it recognizes the right of individuals and groups to engage in peaceful protest, but must also take precautions to do with any potential threat of violence. >> of santos is moved up its annual gun buyback program in the wake of its months shooting rampage in connecticut. >> people to drop off their guns exchange for gross restore gift card no questions asked. >> the mayor says the city's residents were to be protected. >> we want our legislators to do some. we feel like there's too much talking and not enough action. this is an opportunity for reply acting get rid of guns they do not use that they do not need. there are too often stolen. >> this is a hugely successful program the city says it will destroy the guns is given. says the buyback program started in 2009, lawson was has collected 8000 weapons. >> the time now is 4:27. >> coming up on the kron 4 morning news more your forecast. and

freedom of information act, it doesn't tell you the specific type of weaponry that they have there. >> eric: or when the last time they had the gun in the house. it could be from a 1965 permit. >> juliet: that's true. >> kelly: the debate continues throughout the country. meantime, president obama's epa chief resigned and her reason? it may be just a cover-up, according to some. the guy who uncovered her secret e-mails is coming up next. >> juliet: plus, just in time for new year. a hangover cure that can be found in your fridge so you don't have one of these nights. >> you okay, buddy? >> no, i am in so much pain right now. oh, my god. it's gone i love 'em even more. i earn 1% cash back everywhere, evertime. ! >> juliet: 8:44 east coast. the nation's 41st president remains in intensive care. george h.w. bush's chief of staff saying, quote, is he sick? yes. does he plan on going anywhere soon? no. he has every intention of staying put. he would ask me to tell you to please put the harps back in the closet. kriv reporter donnelly keith live outside methodist hospital in houston. they s

well romney apparently through a freedom of information act request, the romney team spent $2.5 million on office space in d.c. almost a quarter of a million dollars on furniture, communications hardware the upside is that some of that is going to be repurposed, and given to other federal entities like any del laptops -- [ inaudible ]. hearings are being held today on what happened on september 11th attack in benghazi. four people have now resigned. senator john kerry is heading up the senate hearings today. he is possibly next in line to become our secretary of state. we're back after the break. all the time now. >> she gets the comedians laughing... >> that's hilarious! >> ...and the thinkers >> okay, so there's wiggle-room in the ten commandments is what you're telling me. >> you would rather deal with ahmadinejad then me. >> absolutely! >> and so would mitt romeny. >> she's joy behar. >> and the best part is that current will let me say anything. what the hell were they thinking? >> only on current tv. [♪ theme music ♪] >> announcer: ladies and gentlemen, it's the "stephanie mil

they're standing by what's public information they got through the freedom of information act. take a look at a quote they put out here. they say we were surprised when we weren't able to obtain information on what kinds and how many weapons people in our market own. had we been able to obtain those records, we would have published them. they wanted to publish more information, and they said in the wake of newtown their readers are sbbed in who their neighborhood does or does not va gun or may have a permit for one. so this is continuing to go wild. big story on cnn.com. people weigh in there as well. >> i understand they can get information on handgun licenses but not semi-automatic weapons and heavy-duty weapons. do we know why? >> this is interesting. the paper said that they reached out to county clerk officials and they're looking for more information they were given. what we know is it's pistol licenses when you look at that red map, i'm glad you mentioned that the red one is for pistol licenses. they were surprised as well about what kinds of information were and were no

of information act. last night no one wanted to speak to the cbs new bus off this statement, sharing information about gun permits in our area -- >> i think it's a bit disinjen yis of them to say they're giving information. they're taking a position on guns. >> reporter: at the white plains train station, reactions are mixed. >> they ought to public the criminals' names who committed gun violence. >> my sister has guns and i never letmy kids go over there. >> reporter: controversial or not, the journal says it's not finished and promises to pub a third article once its compiled. >> it's not that they can't publish these kinds of things. the question is what do you publish at what time and how does it help your readers? and i don't know if this does. >> reporter: for "cbs this morning," jim axelrod good morning. >>> john miller is a former cia director. good morning. >> good morning jeff and jarvis. >> putting that information online, who does that help? >> i spent the day on the phone yesterday with the

of information act. the map doesn't indicate whether the residents actually owned handguns as i mentioned. only they're legally able to do so. and the information doesn't pertain to rifles or shotguns which we've heard so much about in the tragic stories over the last couple weeks. those of course can be bought without a permit. we want to know if the newspaper went too far? i have to say joey jackson joining us former prosecutor and criminal defense attorney, and trial attorney rebecca rose woodland. i didn't see in that video whether that was either of you two in the range but i digress. i got more responses when i posed this question out to the internet world than i have on a lot of issues. >> oh, yeah. jamie: joey, do the people who may claim there was a breach of their privacy even owe the paper obtained the information legally have a case? >> they have no case whatsoever, all right? now this is obviously a major public policy concern. in the wake of these shootings which has devstated the country,

i follow mentions of the freedom of information act and the press and the english and the press, you mentioned england before. there seems to be a vitality in whenever they're doing with the freedom of affirmation act. i just find staggering. i don't know if it is the fact that it is a new-found experience for them or the volume of material that i see coming across in british news accounts based on their capital to process is a staggering. and most of the time for me personally federal government stuff from the united states, maybe not if you combine it with the operations of foia at the state and local level. so, you know, in this applies to estates i suppose we can look to examples outside our own borders. that is more i have seen pretty dramatic change. the other thing i would say is i think some of the technology advances are kind of a mixed bag. i don't want to take offense, but i have seen sometimes some of the loss of focus i feel on the white house part, and we have some actual indications of this, sometimes they get wrapped up and when i was ecology with aspects of collabora

of information act compliances. the front page of usa today as a lengthy piece about poverty in this country. springfield gardens, new york, independent caller. caller: how are ya? it seems to me that the debt goes up because of the wars. when they want to pay for it, they want to pay for it with entitlements. i heard one of the congressman talking thethey cut $500 billion from the military budget, and he does not talk out the percentage of the military budget that was cut and then compare that to the so- called entitlement they want to take away. the last thing i want to say is this, those people -- first of all, i would like to make it clear i don't have anything against any people, but there seems to be a problem when people to think about israel, because they say that they are entitled to the land because of the bible. but i think people should actually read the bible and find -- read galatians 24-4 that says it is an analogy. so it is a story to describe something. it's not even real. that's all i wanted to say

i'm going to put in a freedom of information act request for obama's diary. maybe it's time on government time and maybe the diary itself is a gsa notebook or something like that so they can't make exception obviously. i worry what we don't know is marshaling more than what we do know. >> about what? >> about him, what he's doing, was striving and. who is barack obama? >> last question, about to get the hook. you are talking about the president is a man of mystery. you are a little bit of the minute history yourself. everyone in the service fascinated by how you do what you do. one time he told me how you've reached a general who would take your call. >> wouldn't take the call, wouldn't be interviewed and was a key general and radio silence. i found out where he'd lived and it's the perfect time to go visit a general? at night, 8:15 because they would've eaten. if their home, there's a couple extra hours, so i knocked on the door without an appointment and he opened the door and looked at me and cannot quote him? looked at me and said are you still doing this

so apparently it is, the paper got the names by filing a freedom of information act. but is it the right thing to do? should this newspaper have published this? i could think of a myriad of things that are wrong with this. first of all, now bad guys and gals know where the homes are that have weapons, so if they want to find them, they can go there. and also people who don't have weapons are exposed. so will they become targets of crimes because now bad guys and gals know that these people can't defend themselves potentially in their homes? >> rick: it's striking outrage. somebody on twitter said this makes his blood boil. he says it puts the community in danger. listen to what he had to say. >> publication of these names and addresses of individuals who possess guns gives a list to any criminal of the houses that have guns in case they want to find a low security environment in which to go and steal weapons. we also know which houses don't have guns. this is a severe danger to the community that this newspaper has brought about. this list exposes an inherent bias amo

let's, you know, i'm going to put in a freedom of information act request for obama's diary. maybe it's done on government time, and maybe the diary, itself, is a gsa notebook or something like that, and so they can't -- exception, no, obviously, not going to get it, but i look for -- i worry what we don't know. i'm sure it's larger than what we do thankfully know -- >> about? >> about him, about what he's doing, what's driving him, who's barack obama? >> last question about to get the hook, got the melt down over there. quickly. you were talking about the president's a man of mystery. you're a man of mystery yourself. everyone in the room is fascinated by how you do, what you do, and one time you told me about how you reached a general who wouldn't take your call. >> well, wouldn't take the call, wouldn't -- >> what was this for? >> would not be interviewed, 5 key general on, i think, the fourth bush book, and radio silence so i dpownd out where he -- found out where he lived, and what's the perfect time to go visit a general at night? 8:15 because they would have eaten. if

so let's -- i'm going to put it in the freedom of information act request for obama's diary. maybe it's done on government time and maybe the diary itself is a g.s.a. notebook or something like that and so they can't -- not going to get it. i look for -- i worry what we don't know and i'm sure it's larger than what we do think we know. >> about -- >> about any -- about him. about what he's doing. what's driving him? who's barack obama? >> and last question about to get the hook, the meltdown over there. do this very quickly. you were talking about the president is a man of mystery. you are a man of mystery yourself. everyone in this room is fascinated about how you do what you do. and one time you told me about how you reached a general who wouldn't take your call. >> wouldn't take the call, wouldn't be interviewed. it was a key general on i think the fourth bush book. and so i found out where he lived. what's the perfect time to go visit a general? at night. 8:15. because they would have eaten. if they're home, there are a couple of extra hours there. so i knocked on the doo

i think of them to the freedom of administration act, in some areas and at some times they have interpreted it to release more information than they're predecessor administration or administrations could have. i have seen them do that again to some instances. is not substantially different. they do seem to to be a difficult position and to accord to their predecessors. there has been more of your mission forthcoming to the process. i think it falls short of what open government advocates have expected. >> by a group with a lot of what joshed said. as i said before, the willingness to tackle what are hard issues is to be commended. if i compare us to the previous administration, which i think was the most secretive in modern times, there is no comparison. i think the open government directive is another thing, they are trying to institutionalize things. i have come to appreciate how difficult and challenging that is. when you are dealing with all of the agencies and the cultures that have existed for a time -- the average person processing aid request as well, i will now get in trouble for w