>> the reason we're not somalia or haiti, the program is working. it's counter cyclical. when the economy's bad it increases, when the economy's good, it goes down. the reason we don't have mass starvation is this program is helping tens of millions of american families survive. the facts are, before the 1970s, when we did have the program, we had third world style malnutrition. these programs almost entirely ended hunger in the 1970s. >> that used to be a bipartisan understanding. bob doll is one of the founding fathers of this program. and it used to be a way to help farmers and families. there's a business case for continuing these programs. the biggest recipients of the money. it's all cycled back into the economy. >> no one's saving -- companies like kraft that make the boxed food that's inexpensive to buy, companies like walmart, supermarkets, all plow in the money from these food stamp programs. we also had this interconnectedness of our safety net programs that's going to make this a double problem. feeding america that operates lots of food banks around the count