it's amazing when i say tell me how long you've been with the nsa. 30, 35 years, 38 years. i said goodbye to an employee after 50 years. when i've talked about is particularly given the state of the technology, we have to create a world where evil from nsa can leave for life and work in the private sector provides also like to create a world where does private sector can come spend a little time with us because one of the challenges is the nation that we are dealing with and you have seen this play out over the last year or so in particular. we talk past each other a lot because we don't understand each other. the culture and experience isn't optimized to understand the concerns many of which are very valid from the it corporate partners and likewise many of the individuals that work in the corporate world don't have an understanding of us and i would like to see what we can do to change that because i think it will prove better outcomes for both of us and serve us better as a nation. so thank you very much. >> thank you for your time and all that you do. we look forward to

works for how nsa works. so that doesn't -- that means that our privacy program is going to look different than fbi's or others. it's based on how the organization functions and where the key decisions are being made. so we're working through that. but it turns out procurement isn't the right place. we're looking through in terms of technology and research director and others to make sure we understand where those touch points are. that's why we're beta testing the processes. >> i think i have time for one last question before i turn it over to my fellow board members. alex, this is for you. you pointed to congressional oversight as one of the things that the american people should be aware of that this is happening, it's robust, it's real. a previous panelist pointed out that there is potentially one significant flaw or challenge with congressional oversight, and that's the lack of cleared staff. what is your perception? has congress -- i'm going to ask to you opine on congress. whether consideration should

which is reflected in nsa's authorities. executive 127 triple 3. this analysis framed nsa's protection program by asking where and how the data was collected, i.e., usually overseas, and the status the individual or entity being targeted. i.e., is it a u.s. person or not. as it considers new types of collection answering these types of questions. it is built a strong compliance program based on these with compliance activities embedded in our technologies and systems. as i've learned more about nsa and its compliance regime, its became clear while this is certainly one way to address privacy concerns, it is different from how concerns are addressed outside of nsa. over the last 15 years, congress has pass at variety of laws to protect privacy and other parts of government and the commercial sector. these policies and laws focus more on the nature and content of the data, not where it was -- i'm sorry the nature and content of the data and how it was used. i believe we have an opportunity to bring together nsa's current civil

nsa. over the last 15 years, congress has passed a variety of laws to protect privacy and other parts of government and the commercial sector. these policies and laws focus more on the nature and contents of the data, not where -- i'm sorry, the nature and content of the data and how it is used, not where it was collected or the citizenship of the individual. i believe we have an opportunity the bring together nsa's current civil liberties and privacy analysis with a broader approach to privacy and civil liberties. this new approach also supports the president's ppd28 mandate to recognize that our signals intelligence activities must take into account that all persons should be treated with dignity and respect regardless of their nationality and wherever they might reside and that all persons have legitimate privacy interests in handling their personal information. to address a broader set of civil liberties and privacy interests, i'm testing a civil liberties and privacy assessment proces

the nsa? at what level -- would you respond? guest: absolutely. there is nothing more important than responding to a congressional request. usually it would come through committee on intelligence. anytime there is a congressional inquiry of whatever type. mundanes it involves issues, sometimes serious issues, but anytime there is a congressional request, there is a whole office at nsa that deals with nothing but congressional issues. it other part of it is extends not only to nsa itself, but also into the military services. so, any time the air force, the army, the marine corps, the navy, get any type of congressional inquiry, they have a specific division within their services that handles those inquiries. if it is a dod level, the pentagon has that function as well as. congressional requests, interests, they are taken seriously at the working level, and it is one of the most important things we have. as the air force liaison for intelligence matters to congress within the air force's intelli

how is that affecting morale within the nsa? is there concern about that relationship with the private sector? >> first, we have a formal set of processes that must be applied when individuals do something in addition to their nsa duties. we review that and when circumstances change, we will say, that is not acceptable anymore. the circumstances have changed. the relationship is different. we do that on a recurring basis. for some, it is as simple as someone with a language background saying, i want to use my language on a contracting basis to increase my skills. sometimes we will say yes. sometimes we won't. in terms of the flow of partnerships and information back and fourth, i have been very public about saying for the nsa, i would like us to create a model where members of our workforce don't spend 30 or 35 years working directly for us. it is amazing, the employees that i will talk to. when i say, how long have you been with nsa, 35 years, 38 years. i just said goodbye to an employee after 50 years. given the state of techn

[applause] >> i'm delighted to be known as the good nsa as opposed to the bad nsa. we realize the name of our organization when it is reduced to an acronym is confusing. many people here national security archive and believe that we are the library of the cia. i have to tell them we are the antithesis,, the good nsa. we have a revolutionary slogan. documents are death. that distinguishes me quickly from anybody thinking that i am undercover cia posing as an archivist. i'm going to talk about the bay of pigs and the efforts to get that material declassified through a question-and-answer between me and brenda. what i wanted to talk about this morning is the chapter on kennedy in the new book. back channel to cuba. and his back channels to cuba. you will find the book contains more be jealous that any other place on this rather fascinating history. the kennedy assassination has intrigued us all. it intrigues me as a historian of u.s. cuban relations for many reasons. one of which is that this ministry that efforts to reject the fidel castro is so counter to the known i

the nsa be aware bethat call -- would be nsa aware of that call? >> not necessarily. they are looking at certain discrete numbers that have been targeted. it goes through a specific their time to waste not matter.hat do by law they are not allowed to intercept u.s. persons and get of that content conversation. they may be collecting metadata at the far end. things that is potentially connected to. that usually requires a court order to do that. it also is one of those areas where the way in which the youection apparatus works, are looking at very specific entities. if someone is calling their grandmother, no big deal, but if someone is calling the presidential palace in damascus, different story. thing theykind of look at. there are certain areas that are targeted, certain areas that are not. of it, would be aware correct? >> not necessarily. >> if we were to take this computer and search for al qaeda and type itd isis into the search engine, would the nsa be aware of that? generally speaking not. the reason they wouldn't be type of it is anyone ca

known as surprise at the nsa is collecting phone records. been getting all phone records in the entire country. this is bad. a fair reading of the statute does not grant them this authority. the classification of pfizer boostorders would transparency. we should not be a nation of secret laws. the government should provide transparency around the scope of requests for data. this includes reporting about national security surveillance activity such as hominy requests were made. the government should authorize the private sector to make similar reports. information is power and privacy is control of information. to possess information about an individual has power over that individual. large-scale information collection threatens the relationship between citizens and the state. it throws off the balance of power. them to -- with much more targeted data collection and trade transparency. thank you. >> john grant is our next panelist. he is a civil liberties engineer. he oversaw the department of homeland security. thanks for being here. >> thank

you can bet the bulk of the e-mails relating to the nsa and gchq were encrypted. >> story did the nsa tapping into the cell phone has james ball's name on the by line. eventually, he was named as one of the recipients of the pulitzer prize the guardian won story. i sat down with james ball in london to get his take on encryption, source protection and journalism in the post edward snowden era. >> james ball of the guardian, today. >> thank you. >> in your communications when he was setting up the interview, did you en crypt it? >> we did not. >> why not? >> because unfortunately, while time. >> yes? >> in theory, in practice, you can't get anything done. every day we have to compromise. if we try to tell people to be ultra secure, you know, if we are doing that is it would take us an hour to get out of the pass. it does not the mean you are not very important. >> before snowden there was assange and wiki leaks. is it possible to summarize some of the changes in journalism that have occurred as a result of what wick i leaks and assange did first? >> two distinct lessons, they learned t

then there are stories about the nsa nsa spying on foreign populations indiscriminately, putting entire populations under a surveillance microscope. then there are stories about the nsa spying on friendly governments like the president of brazil or the president of the chancellor of germany and then there are stories about the nsa spying on adversarial countries like china or iran or pakistan. there is this sense in the united states unsurprisingly that the only legitimate stories are the ones about the nsa spying on their own citizens, on americans, and we have done a lot of reporting about the nsa spying on foreign populations. sne deny once asked about this. i say all the time, the idea that the only privacy that matters is that the privacy of americans,ch and the rest world, which happens to be 95% that's not americans, that their privacy is irrelevant, so irrelevant is actually grotesque. snowden was adamant from the start that he regarded internet privacy as being the privacy of individuals around the world regardless of nationalalty to eyes enter the from without monitoring and i

the fact is the nsa doesn't listen to the phone calls. they drill down on the numbers. >> to protect us. >> i'm all for looking at that person's records if you get a warrant. there's no reason not to get a warrant. >> it delays the investigation. >> there is a rapist in d.c. you want to catch him. what do the police do? they call a judge in front of the house. >> do you think the judge says no? >> if the judge always say yes how does the warrant protect us. >> let's say you want all the records of all the reasons in texas the judge will say no. it's a great protection. i'm not willing to give up on it because i fear the time when maybe someone in government becomes so not well intentioned. i don't think president obama is a bad man. his motives are good. but what about the next president or the president after that. >> senator paul argues that we catch more terrorists without tracking every phone call. >> we take our eye off the prize by spending so much time mining information from innocent individuals and spend less time targeting our a

in four broad categories, nsa spying on its own citizens. then there are stories about the n nsa spying on foreign populations indiscriminately, putting entire populations under a surveillance microscope. then there are stories about the nsa spying on friendly governments like the president of brazil or the president of the chancellor of germany and then there are stories about the nsa spying on adversarial countries like china or iran or pakistan. there is this sense in the united states unsurprisingly that the only legitimate stories are the ones about the nsa spying on their own citizens, on americans, and we have done a lot of reporting about the nsa spying on foreign populations. sne deny once asked about this. i say all the time, the idea that the only privacy that matters is that the privacy of americans,ch and the rest world, which happens to be 95% that's not americans, that their privacy is irrelevant, so irrelevant is actually grotesque. snowden was adamant from the start that he regarded internet privacy as being the privacy of i

they're actually saying, the nsa, we know the nsa collected verizon communications, because we have this order to remember visine. we're verizon customers. they're our communications records, again, have been not content, have been collected, and they allege both statutory and constitutional violations. so in the statutory realm, in the aclu case for example, they allege that section 215 itself does not authorize the nsa to collect in bulk call detail records from u.s. companies. the basic argument there is the statute requires that a record be relevant to an ongoing investigation and their argument is basically that all records cannot be relevant, otherwise relevance has no meaning. the arguments we have seen in briefing from the government, and in opinions that have been released from the fisa court, on the other side, is essentially an argue umtd of necessity. where the government says we have a need to collect all these records, because in order to get -- again in order to get the needles we need the haystack. which is not really an argument about relevance so much as it is an argume

he said nsa is not in the american private sector networks. can you take a couple of sentences and explain that again. i think that is so important. unfortunately i think people believe the nsa is on the private sector networks. it's not which is candidly why the bad guys have such an opportunity to swim around in there. can you talk about back? this to me as one of the most important points we can make there to the american public today about what we are trying to do and why the fact you are not on there and don't want to be in there and so forth. >> the national security agencies of foreign intelligence agency. it is not a domestic intelligence agency. u.s. persons include an entity in the form of a company. we are specifically legally limited from doing that. we do not have a presence on u.s. private networks inside companies. that is not what we are about them that is not what our mission is. it's because of that lack on our part that i'm saying what i need a partnership here. we need to exchange information and you don't want us on most p

. , youunderstand the nsa have that planned. but the cyber command is self, do you have a blend as well? >> the ratios are different. at u.s. cyber command, we are probably 80% military. >> is there a pay differential between the two workforces? >> i have never heard that issue raised. retention, at angelos university in texas, we have a great cyber training facility as well as an air force base. traininga lot of money , giving these kids tools that are valuable in the private sector. what are the retention issues you are dealing with? , retention has exceeded expectations. that is largely due to the fact -- and it is not unique to cyber . you can look at almost any military set. we are not going to compete on the basis of pay. we will attract people who have -- who are attracted to the egos and culture, this idea of serving something bigger than yourself. we attract people who like yet the of service to the nation as a core part of what they do. we will attract people who are attracted to the idea of you are doing something tha

there are stories about nsa of spying on their own citizens, stories about nsa spying on foreign populations indiscriminately , putting entire populations under surveillance microscopes. then there are stories about the nsa spying on a friendly governments to of the chancellor of germany, and there are stories about spying on adversarial countries like china pakistan. there is this sense in the united states unsurprisingly that the only legitimate stories are the ones about the nsa spy on their own citizens. and we have done a lot of reporting about the nsa spying on foreign populations. and i say all the time, the idea that the only privacy that matters is the privacy of americans and that the rest of the world, which by the way, happens to be 95 percent of the world, that their privacy is irrelevant, in fact so irrelevant it should not be reported on is grotesque. and snowden was adamant from the start that he regarded internet privacy as being the privacy of individuals around the world regardless of nationality to use the internet without monitoring innovation. the debate is a valid one.

>> i think we could do that. >> that's what the nsa has told us. my only fear is, again the biggest debate, you want congrescopiesto purchase but bes voluntary. we need to make sure the liability standards are right if they are, in fact, in good faith trying to provide malicious source code without pii that these companies are not held to some different standard when accidentally, could happen, pii gets through. you would want the company's making some effort. you would want an essay to have a system to strip the pii before got into the database which is easy for you to do i would argue down a multitude of thousands of companies trying to share malicious source code that they've originated in russia or china or iran or north korea, or some international organized crime element. i just want to make sure we have the full and open discussion about what that looks like and why there are concerns about limiting the number of companies that participate. it has more vulnerabilities to the whole system. i just wanted to make sure we made that clear and was

is expecting a senior nsa guy. he looks over there and sees little edward snowden this tiny skinny guy. he has the rubik cube. i'm looking for a senior nsa guy by the skinnier. to make a long story short they talk and this is where we are. we are almost ready here. our house for the evening, our actual hostess jesse brown. jesse brown is a real journalist unlike me. i'm just a guy with a big mouth and he's had a lot of experience. he has worked at cbc and has his own web site called canada land. jesse is going to do an interview with glenn after glenn's talk so he will talk for 30 or 40 minutes and then just england will interview. jesse has promised me a probing interview. that is basically the thing so i guess i'll just leave it at that. jesse is going to introduce glenn. before i go out there to thank everyone for coming and i thank my sponsors and my wife are helping me. she has been instrumental and also turn off your cell phones and put them in the refrigerator. i don't know how people got that joke but it's

there are massive amounts of audit logs for example in an organization like the nsa. and that's a lot of information. but you can use technology and analystic tools to mick sense of that information. and drive the insights that you're looking for. so at the part of the issue is, a, you need to do it. you need someone so we see this all the time and i know other organizations see this as well, which is everybody checks the box for audit logs. we've got audit logs and we will go through an enormous number of hoops to make sure it is logging exactly the information that it is supposed to. we get fewer requests to actually look at the audit logs once the auditing mechanisms are logged on. there aren't many laws i can tell that tell anyone they have to look at audit logs. it is the seinfeld joke about renting a car. everyone can take the reservation. but to hold the reservation, to use the information. so i think, to me, that's how make oversight more effective. you use these techniques. and that's another thing. oversight people and the information security people and thi

where they claim to protect the identity and location, they have been repeatedly violated by a the nsa and the other government -- >> u.s. still not answering my question. what is it that has happened to use that shows it must've come from this -- abuses or exercise of rights on section 215 under this program? >> the totality of the evidence, the nature of metadata, we had invasion into my cellphone and the computers and cellphones -- >> what are the invasions? >> a different instance. they are on a computer and all of sudden a picture is taken of them purportedly by some entity related to the fbi. they don't have a camera on their computer, they're getting calls from afghanistan, strange calls that have nothing to do with their having communicated with afghanistan with regard to their dead son. this son -- >> it sounds very peculiar and not sure how what links them to this program. >> regrettably it is not peculiar because our government--i am a former justice department lawyer and founder of judicial watch, "freedom watch". the regrettable fact is the government has not been telling

when you said the nsa is not on those american private sector networks. can you take just a couple of sentences and explain that again? i think that is so important. because unfortunately i think people believe the nsa is on the private sector networks. it's not which is candidly why the bad guys have so much opportunity to swim around in the. this to me as with most important points we can make clear to the american public debate about what we are trying to do and why that part, whether that you're not on there and don't want to be on there is so important. >> the nsa is a foreign intelligence organization. it is not a domestic intelligence organization. the article constraints placed on us when it comes to collection against u.s. persons. u.s. persons include the definition of use entity in the form of a company. we are specifically legally limited from doing that. we do not have a presence on u.s. private networks inside companies. that's not what we're about. that's not what our mission is. it's because of that lack of awareness if you will on her par

>> with four broad categories of stories of nsa spying on its own citizens than the nsa to spy on foreign populations indiscriminately entire populations under a surveillance microscope then spying on friendly governments like that chancellor of germany then then assays spying on adversarial countries like pakistan. there is a sense in the united states the only legitimate stories are about the nsa spying on their own citizens. we have done a lot of reporting and snowden once asked about this and i say all the time the idea the only privacy that matters is the privacy of matters and fibers and other rugged is not american their privacy is irrelevant and should not be reported on is grotesque. and snowden was adamant from the start -- the start that to use the internet's but the debate with the government is valid. with the stories on spying on democratic leaders were significant because a lot of people don't think any government should do that. that is debatable but i have stayed away from stories of u.s. government spying on adversary governments because that i don't think is all that in

they are saying, the nsa -- we know the nsa collected verizon communications because we have this order to verizon. we are verizon customers. our communications records have been -- not content, have been collected. they allege both statutory and constitutional violations. so in the statutory realm in the aclu case, they allege that section 215 itself does not authorize the nsa to collect in bulk call detail records from u.s. companies. the basic argument is that the statute requires the records be relevant to an ongoing investigation. their argument is that all records cannot be relevant. otherwise, relevance has no meaning. the arguments we have seen both in briefing from the government and in opinions that have been released from the court on the other side is essentially an argument of necessity. the government says we have a need to collect all these records because in order to get the needles, we need the haystack, sch not an argument about relevance so much about necessity. it's not clear why it's the case that necessity should be sufficient where the statute says relevance. that

when would nsa step in, and what's the policy thinking there? what would that look like? >> first, i would argue the most likely scenario is probably u.s. cyber command and the dod, the national security agency. one of our three missions is when directed by the president or the secretary to provide capability to defend a critical u.s. infrastructure. now, our role to do that will, quite frankly, our mission will be to attempt to interdict the activity before it ever gets to that u.s. network, that u.s. company. that's our primary strategy, and that's what dod brings to this. a subset of our strategy is if we should fail in that regard, we have also developed some defensive response capability that we can deploy to partner with dhs, the fbi and the private sector about. so it goes to tom's question about, so, how do you remediate, how do you mitigate? if you've failed and they've breached, so to speak, how do you remediate and mitigate? that's the u.s. cyber command side. that's a legal call because, again, you have to be tasked, and that's what the president, you know, re

floor, the current congress has work to hopefully finish up from isis and ebola to internet access nsa surveillance, key ston keystone, and one thing that needs to be passed is a spending bill. if washington wants to avoid a government shutdown just in time for the holidays. only 185 bills have passed this congress putting it on pace to be the least productive congress in modern history. the big question now, do dems try to force through party agenda items or focus on the must-pass bills? according to gallup poll just 36%, dems approval. no big surprise when you look at the november 4th election results. as for the gop, their favorability keeps rising but has only hit 42%. "the new york times" warns, quote, if this congress cannot make deals now, they might never be able to. well, there's something then to look forward to. what a positive way to begin with our first guest, congressman peter welch, democrat from vermont. thank you for being on the show. we appreciate it. >> thank you. >> so first question right out of the gate, we hear from the republicans that if the president moves fo

in terms of the nsa prosecutors have far greater subpoena power towards these records and let the nsa has. it has been ruled constitutional by cords so this is really being blown out of proportion in terms of what the nsa is doing. it's very limited and we have a great deal of monitoring oversight. again we have people on the right and far left monitoring and making sure we are not abusing american civil liberties. again we face some very significant threats in this nation. we need intelligence gathering capabilities. let's not hamstring people and keeping them safe. >> host: we will move onto bronx new york. democratic call, joe. >> caller: good morning greta, how are you doing today? good morning senator johnson. >> guest: how about just one question? it's hard to keep track. >> caller: let's talk about immigration. number one immigration especially hearing the republicans talk about the border, most of the time you have heard people say the border has been secured. that is not the problem. what i am saying to you today is i'm asking you this question. why do you think the republica

i think someone mentioned the new cpo at nsa. what we'll see different now is not only are we complying with law going to be something that's factored into all of the software that's developed and all of the tools and techniques and procedures but also now, well, just because it complies with law, should we really be doing it? and what's the extra step we're going to take to really consider privacy at the on set? >> so you sound reasonably satisfied with the fact that they're taking it seriously and doing the best they can? >> i absolutely do. i wish -- i actually feel very comforted by the fact that the government has a ton of oversight and a ton of laws to comply with. and i personally am much more worried about the large collection and amount of collection that's taking place in industry that people don't really understand. >> all right. so i can get on to my next -- mr. bedoya, you talked about how important it was to limit collection to what was necessary or purposeful, et cetera. but in light of so many of the experts on bo

this bill doesn't tackle every problem with the nsa but makes three changes, stops the nsa from gathering our phone records in bulk. the bill ends the one sided core process for surveillance adding a people's advocate, that's the idea president obama said after the snowden leaks. >> to insure the court hears a broader range of privacy perspective. i'm also calling on congress to establish a panel of advocates from outside government to provide an individual voice in significant cases before the so court. >> not a bad idea. finally the bill would force government secret spy court to change legal opinions to change our laws. can have secret intelligence but not secret laws. these are good steps forwards. as the deadline approaches next year, reformers will have more leverage, we can finally put the scare tactics in the garbage and figure out how to form a spy agency that has long shown it is unable to reform itself. i'm looking forward to it. that does it for the show here on "the cycle". "now" with alex wagner starts now. >>> for a lame duck, president obama is sure ruffling a lot of feath

there's sun was in nsa cryptologist. my clients have been critical of the government. we have on the record -- and judge leon didn't rely on it -- affidavit showing their computers had been accessed by the government. that's in the record. and i'm a lawyer and the -- and -- the aclu makes the same argument by obtaining my , metadata, seeing who i'm calling and having in fact going three steps down the line to what i do violates the most sacrosanct privilege in the law. my attorney-client privilege. so this case needs to be seen, not just in the context of what's happening to all americans which is perhaps the biggest violation of freedom and constitutional rights in american history, but it has to be seen in the context of the particular plaintiffs in this case who have had their attorney-client privilege desecrated, destroyed, violated. >> the desecration of which you speak occurs if and only if in which the government officials reached the third step of this process, that is move from collection through querying to actually examination of the numbers and following ou

well need real nsa reforms. urge your representative to hold up the representation. >> i really don't buy that argument because this was real reform. this is the law that would make the proceedings of the secret court more transparent. this would end the bulk collection of americans' meta data, who they call, when they call, where they call, who they e-mail, what websites they search. this was an opportunity to make real change. was it perfect? no. but i don't ever think congress comes up with perfect answers. but this would have been a major positive first step to push this legislation forward and end the surveillance state. >> susan, you're next. ft. myers, florida. go ahead. republican caller. >> yes, ma'am, i'm kind of pro and con on this. if you remember tim mcveigh, we had a homegrown terrorist who attacked our own citizens and killed many innocent people. i don't know if this would have stopped it or prevented it. and you know, i always kind of figured just from what i'd gleaned in the world, you know, th

in past conversations that is what the nsa has told told us i believe that's accurate. my only fear is and this was the biggest debate you want companies to participate because this is voluntary. we need to make sure that the liability standards are right if they are in fact good faith to provide malicious source code without pii these companies aren't held to a different standard and accident when it could happen so you want the companies making some effort. you want the nsa to have the system to strip that pii before gone into the database which is easier for you to do i would argue the multitudes of thousands of companies trying to share malicious source code they have originated in russia or china or iran or north korea or some international organized crime element. it is want to make sure we have that full discussion about what that looks like and why there are concerns about limiting the number of companies that could participate. just as more vulnerability to the system. i wanted to make sure we made that clear and it was on the record. you were saved by the bell

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we have former nsa cyber chief. you don't want to miss that. liz: are banks turning into risky investments. black friday turning into black week? will it lead into more profits by stretching out black friday several days? >>> did the government silently admitting that aig didn't really need your tax dollars? maybe, maybe not. that and much more with our panel straight ahead. liz: cisco shares inching higher with big news on management change. david: let's head back to adam shapiro at the new york stock exchange. i guess news is circulating there, adam. >> she is kelly cramer. before that she spent 20 years with general electric. she has been ceo for ge health care businesses and life science and diagnostics. she held different leadership positions for general electric. she will replace frank calderon. cisco coming in with earnings of 54 cents a share which beat the street which was expecting 52 cents. revenue slightly better than expected. street was expecting 12.16 billion. liz: thank you, adam shapiro. wilbur ross made a fortune betting on be

what are the kinds of threats you have seen from inside the nsa? can you still be a civil libertarian? >> absolutely. it is not an either or. datau are going to use the , what are the safeties we have around it to protect our civil liberties and privacy? that has never been fully explained. we did a terrible job of explained that. that needs to be explained on the cyber security side. put it out there and let people understand. some type oft for attack to occur and then say we should have done this. we already know. you brought it up. we saw it in 2012. is there a certain industry you think is most horrible? vulnerable -- most honorable? >> lectured power, the government, financial sector. -- electric power. they pay us to be paranoid. >> it is justified. >> we are delighted to have you here. thank you so very much. >> good to see you. >> general keith alexander, former director of the nsa. we will be back in a couple of minutes on "market makers." macy's and ceo of the cofounder of pbg. ♪ >> all those guest coming on, plus the ceo of virgin amer

this is a free advice to the new privacy officer over at nsa. >> well, thank you. as i alluded to in my opening remarks, one, there is no silver bullet. you need to take a number of approaches. we've taken a number of approaches to drive awareness and sensitivity around privacy to our workforce through a number of steps on mandatory training that is required for all employees that cover a range of ethical and compliance issues. deeper role-based training the specific to software engineers and specific to sales and marketing people, that specific different roles that people play in the company that impact customer privacy. we have as i mentioned not just sort of told people what the rules are and crossed our fingers and hope they abide by them. we have put in checkpoints in the way that we develop internal system. the way you develop software and get out the door that has to go through certain checkpoints and reviews to ensure that privacy issues are not overlooked. there's a number of things we've done along those lines to make sure people are aware and have the to

now, that's just in reaction to america's nsa action. we all learned about that from edward snowden, e-mails, web habits, phone calls, all being tracked. >>> a federal court here in america is taking a look at nsa. remember they were tracking the physical records of nearly every phone call in america, so your phone calls, but is that a violation of your rights if no analyst ever looks at it? after all, the nsa says, we have to record every number of every call if we're going to go back and later look to see if a certain number pops up. they say that isn't spying. it's actually a bit like what google had with book publishers a couple years back. google wanted to make books searchable, so you could find facts, passages of a book and presumably buy the book once you found it. publishers thought google was violating their copyright, but google said we have to scan the whole book to digital in order to understand what's in it, but nobody but our computers is going to read it. nsa is saying the same thing, the computer records calls after you

i think someone mentioned the new cpo at nsa. what we'll see different now is not only are we complying with law going to be something that's factored into all of the software that's developed and all of the tools and techniques and procedures but also now, well, just because it complies with law, should we really be doing it? and what's the extra step we're going to take to really consider privacy at the on set? >> so you sound reasonably satisfied with the fact that they're taking it seriously and doing the best they can? >> i absolutely do. i wish -- i actually feel very comforted by the fact that the government has a ton of oversight and a ton of laws to comply with. and i personally am much more worried about the large collection and amount of collection that's taking place in industry that people don't really understand. >> all right. so i can get on to my next -- mr. bedoya, you talked about how important it was to limit collection to what was necessary or purposeful, et cetera. but in light of so many of the experts on bo

recently about the nsa working part-time. >> there've been reports recently about employees in the nsa working part-time and some former employees going on to the private sector. how is that affecting the morale in the nsa and is there any concern about that particular relationship and classified information sort of jumping from within the borders of the nsa. >> we have processes that must be applied when individuals are going to do something in addition. we do that consistently over time and window circumstances change, what was acceptable at one point we say it's not acceptable. to change the nature of the relationship is different so we do that in a recurring basis. with the language background of background they say look i want to use my language outside nsa on a contractor basis because i think that it will increase my skills and so we would say yes that makes sense and sometimes we don't. in terms of the flow of partnerships and information back and forth, i've been very public about saying for the national security agency i would like us to create a model where the members of ou

. >>> hrrpling news from the new man at the nsa. he said china a few other countries could mount cyber attacks to cut off your lights and cut your power. >> it was a stark and blunt assessment from the new director of the nsa, mike rogers, publicly confirmed what has been widely discuss privately by the intelligence community. a handful of nations, including china, have the the capacity to shut down the u.s. power grid with a cyber attack. >> there shouldn't be any doubt in our minds there are nations, states and groups that have the capability to do that. to enter those industrial control items and shut down and stall our ability to operate our basic infrastructure. >> cyber intrusions and espionage are a special unit of the peoples liberation army housed in a 12-story building in suburb answer shanghai. nsa director rogers said he supports attacking emergency response systems off-limits. and he warned a cat traffic event is all but assured in the next decade and the u.s. must go on the offensive. >> being on the defensive is a tot

we need reform of the nsa programs, but not in this manner. let's remember why this intelligence tool was put into place. it was enacted in the wake of the first terrorist attack in our country that took the lives of nearly 3000 people. and we have testimony from the former director at the fbi, from the former deputy director of the cia telling us that had this tool been in place, it is likely, most likely, that the plot that killed nearly 3000 people would have been uncovered. why would we weaken the ability of our intelligence community at a time when the threats against this country have never been greater? and let me address to my colleagues the privacy issue that has been raised. an issue that all of us care about. this data, these data are far more safe, far more subject to privacy protections if they are held by the federal government were only 22 decades and trained government employees have access to them. instead, of nearly 150 telecommunications companies that employ thousands of workers, and the government is going to have to go to

. >>> plus, new revelations the nsa was worried about the nsa even before edward snowden became a household name. >>> and welcome back. fairly quiet day on the markets, unless you're go pro. go pro lost about 6% this morning as it put yet more shares on the market. a ton of go pro shares now on the market. >>> the associated press has uncovered new evidence that shows fairly senior level officials at the national security agency were concerned that according to the activity of american phone calls was illegal long before edward snowden exposed it. the nsa has since admitted it tracks nearly every single american cell phone call. those officials say they did bring their concerns to their boss at the time. general keith alexander, pointing out it was contrary to the nsa mission to spy on americans. alexander said the agency would continue the plan. now the associated press says those top officials have come up with a compromise that was surprisingly close to the plan that failed in the senate this week. well, new this morning, there will not be another steve jobs movie, at least not any time

. >>> the senate blocked a bill to end bulk collection of phone records by the nsa. it dealt a blow to president obama to reign in surveillance. it would require the nsa to obtain a court order to analyze the records in terrorism cases. >>> an investigation is under way and a chicago neighborhood is stunned after a plane crashed into a house in the middle of the night killing the pilot. the twin engine cargo plane narrowly missed an elderly couple who was rescued by neighbors. the pilot was trying to turn back when the plane went down blocks away from midway airport. >>> and ferguson, missouri, and the rest of the country awaits the grand jury. 16 people were sworn in yesterday. the racially diverse group is charged with looking into issues in the aftermath of the shooting and helping the community shooting. >>> and non-political news out of capitol hill. showing the 52 miles of scaffolding. they can start the next phase of a $60 million restoration. including repairing cracked cast iron and three new coats of paint. it's scheduled to be done by the next presidential

flipside, the nsa intrusions have been a little exaggerated. i remember a long time ago that i was in your meeting with the director of central intelligence and somebody said, what do we do about these companies. they will use encryption to make it harder to see what they are up to. aboutswer is, don't worry it, it's my problem, i will take care of it. at the end of the day, the nsa will have to spend more money and work harder but they will still be able to do what they need to do. companiesers of these will be safer from all kinds of hacking, maybe including the nsa. >> the notion of what is private to whom, google arguing their customers need privacy from the government isn't the same as arguing that customers need privacy from google itself. >> there is a little bit of irony and some people now say, i'm not going to use an american company. i will use a russian e-mail server. you've got to be kidding. it's just the environment we live in. the rules are weak, technology is easy to hack. come to these are doing a good thing by making it harde

on the nsa, local prosecutors have greater subpoena powers and the nsa. this is not even able. it has been ruled constitutional -- you legal. it has been ruled constitutional. it has been blown out of proportion. your people on both the right and the far left are monitoring to make sure we are not accusing american civil liberties. again, we face very significant threats in this nation. we need intelligence gathering capabilities. let's not hamstring people that are trying to keep us safe. i do not have any cancer's for the others. host: bronx, new york. democratic caller. joe. caller: good morning, greta. this is joe the counselor from the bronx, new york. guest: how about just one question. it is hard to keep track. 1 -- [laughter] -- i hearmigration people talking about the border, the border, and most of the time you hear people say the border has been secured. that is not the problem. what i am saying to you today -- why asking this question, do you think republicans do not want to see immigration? sometimes immigration -- sometimes republicans on this station without it t

now the nsa director is confirming my fears. admiral michael rogers told congress yesterday the chinese an possibly two other countries have the ability to flip the switch on our power grid through a cyber attack. >> there shouldn't be any doubt in our minds that there are nation groups hathat have the ability to do that, to shut down, forestall our ability to operate our basic infrastructure. >> here's the thing that deprives me crazy. i've been warning you about it. the only way you can do that is you have to know how the power grids work, you have to know how the computers works, and what happens? we bring these kids in here, they learn how to do -- before they go back home and hack, they go and hack into our power grids. this is a very dangerous thing. this is the why the chinese by far are the single most dangerous country this country has ever faced. >> there are two kinds of hacking going on in this world, the hacking of our commuters and the hacking of our heads. i put isis before china because they are actually decapita