but bernie sanders doesn't have that. he's not winning against hillary with older voters, not winning against her with younger voters. he's not going to win against voters. i don't know what bernie sanders ceiling, but not close enough that would make hillary worry right now. >> about the arizona minorities? arrogance. if you oar democratic candidate running for president right now you have to expect protest from immigration groups, from lgbt, groups and from black lives matters groups. it's part of the job and if you're not prepared to handle that then you shouldn't be running for office. and bernie sanders came out, he had seen the protestors already rake martin o'malley over the coals. he sort of dismissed them like a grumpy old man, like get off my lawn and he made that worse. >> yet hillary clinton didn't even bother to go to net roots which burned a lot of people that were there and secondly as people look at the policies bernie sanders is promoting, his policies would actually do a lot more according to his campaig

. >> up next why do bernie sanders and be be donald trump have in common? be the issue has their opponents scared and we'll tell you what it is when we come back. are. >> we've talked a lot on the show about no-shot political candidates, the candidates that seem to have zero chance of becoming president but still enter the race. pundits and commentators were willing to add bernie sanders and donald trump to the list. but the trump and sanders campaign appear to be gaining traction and their surge continues. the other night bernie sanders drew 7500 supporters for a rally in portland, main and before, a group of 10,000 showed up in madison, wisconsin. the theme seem to be resonating. >> the american people understand that establishment politics and establishment economics is not working for middle class. they understand that the greed of wall street and the greed of corporate america is destroying the great middle class of this country. >> as for trump, he's drawing more controversy than crowds. trump's acerbic antiimmigration stance has caused him imormts an

next - bernie sanders is the political opposite of donald trump. one thing they have in common is an ability to shake up the establishment. trump is making a former candidate nervous. >> we have someone that is bombastic saying "i'm the greatest, i can do this." i fear that because i think this is how people get dangerous leaders in a country when things are bad >>> a conversation with rand paul when we come back. k. >>> there's more than a year and three months before americans vote for the next president. so far 17 republicans and five democrats joined the race. at the early stage they are out raising money, campaigning for votes even if most are long shots at best. it's a long bizarre process that is familiar to former republican congressman rand paul. he ran for president. paul has a book out, a life in war time, a future of peace and prosperity. it is an impassioned critique. she had an involvement in wars abroad. rand paul praised president obama would prays nuclear agreement, opposed by most republicans, including the son, the presidential c

that i can tell you. >> democratic presidential candidate bernie sanders was welcomed by 10,000 people in wisconsin. trump topped him with this

senator bernie sanders. a new marist poll shows sanders is the only candidate with a positive favorabilityleility rating in new hampshire. s a only candidate with a positive favorable raiding in iowa. hit clint has a necessary favorability rating of negative 19. donald trump negative 28. meanwhile some politicians and inside the beltway media folk they just don't have faith in bernie sanders. we've been hearing it for months. >> this is why bernie sanders will not be the democratic nominee. he is consigned to have a lot of difficulty because he has so little support among african americans and hispanics. >> the broader point bernie will also not become president like donald trump will not become president. he does strike a cord. >> passionate followers can never win the nomination. >> i think bernie is too liberal to gather enough votes in this country to become president and i think hillary clinton is going to be a fantastic president. >> he is not remotely electable. and i guess the question is do the demo

that gets to bernie sanders enthusiasm. he genuinely came out so hard and said she should have more. but peter pointed out this still is not done. once we get to the substance of this matter she'll have to comment on this again. and that will put her against me. >> here's another issue that has percolated and that's immigration this time because of the wonderful -- or whatever you would describe it infrut donald trump. he, of course, would famously announce and part of his announcement he discussed how mexicans were rapists. this is what he said when he was asked this week about it. donald: people coming into our country, we have no idea and they're have all over the world. we have no idea who they are. we have to have strong borders. if we don't have strong borders you don't have a country anymore. gwen: he's not backing away and it's making it very difficult for some republicans who have been trying to tread a path. >> no question. i was watching all weekday by day by day we've seen different republicans saying we don't n

next - bernie sanders is the political opposite of donald trump. one thing they have in common is an ability to shake up the establishment. trump is making a former candidate nervous. >> we have someone that is bombastic saying "i'm the greatest, i can do this." i fear that because i think this is how people get dangerous leaders in a country when things are bad >>> a conversation with rand paul when we come back. it is an impassioned critique. she had an involvement in wars abroad. rand paul praised president obama would prays nuclear agreement, opposed by most republicans, including the son, the presidential candidate. the younger paul campaigned on the father's libertarian ideas of small government. deregulation. perhaps to be his own man, rand paul harshly criticized accommodation with iran. he promises to vote against the iran agreement in the senate. i arrived rand paul if his son is making a mistake voting against the deal. here is what he told me. >> well we have a disagreement. it remains to be seen whether it's a mistake or not. i don't r

bernie sanders -- wall street. bernie sanders rallies against wall street. when we talk about it's too expensive to take care of veterans but we can bail out wall street to the tune of 16 trillion. that is infuriating. when it comms to standing up for the american people across the nation, bernie sanders has the record. >> you know what some democrats and observers say he can't win. what do you say? >> i say to the critics, they are flat-out wrongs. bernie sanders is on fire right now. he will continue to be on fire until he wins the democratic nomination. he's the only candidate drawing crowds of 10,000 plus. as everyone nose yesterday -- knows yesterday there were house parties across the nationful over 100,000 gathered together to mobile illize against one special candidate. to the pundits and critics, i say we haven't had a single debate. >> what is hillary clinton is the nominee, could you vote for hillary clinton? >> that is something that i don't want to the consider right now. right now my full-support is backhand "borderland". i -- band "borderland"

he's also interviewed bernie sanders many times. welcome to you both. pat, when you see trump and what he does -- i know you've had-h your own encounters in the past. similar to what you rode in '92? >> there are similarities. trump's from the republican base he's exposing that and hitting two of the strong populous histories. one is overlap with bernie sanders that's the trade issue, export of american jobs and factories and what's happening to the american middle class. the other one trump is hitting which is one of the hottest issues in the whole west as well as the united states, is the massive invasion, if you will and what people feel is the conquest of the west by massive third world immigration from refugees and border jumpers and all the rest. he's wired into both of these and they're enormously popular issues. >> john, even when you talk about immigration immigration is tied to economics. both appealing to the same working class voters who feel left behind, is that fair? >> i don't think so. >> okay. >> i think our politics has really divided

as we go live to another massive rally for bernie sanders. does hillary clinton have an actual electoral challenge on her hands? plus, the republican problem with more great polling news for donald trump. >> the illegals are pouring into the country. it's far worse than anybody knows. >> general joy reid reporting live from the scene of the south carolina church fire. and as the resistance to marriage equality continues in pockets around the nation, my interview with the kentucky county clerk who would rather to go jail than issue same-sex marriage licenses. >> i think they have the right to choose however they choose. but i do too. i have the same right. >> "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. at this very hour we are anticipating what is likely to be the single largest noncompulsory campaign event of the 2016 presidential election. i am speaking, of course, of vermont senator bernie sanders appearing as you see in a packed stadium arena in madison, wisconsin. sanders, of course, coming fresh off of a massi

or is bernie sanders emerging as a serious, credible threat? >> i don't know if he's emerging as the type of serious threat that could keep her from winning the democratic nomination. but he is emerging as a threat in the sense that he is someone who is going to have enough money to play for a long time. he is speaking to a part of the democratic party that the clinton campaign has known for a long time could be a problem for her. and i think the bigger question is, does what we're seeing with bernie sanders, the enthusiasm, the money, the crowds, does that draw someone else in? a joe biden perhaps. does it show that there is space in the democratic party for someone to run a serious challenge against hillary. >> it's a great question. is it just that he's doing everything right? his timing was great. he had some people who had sort of hovered waiting to see if elizabeth warren would run. she didn't. he stepped in and took that spot on the left and blew martin o'malley away and took that group. is it because bernie sanders is doing everything r

look bernie sanders has a ceiling. he's not going to be the democratic nominee, not going to be ultimately a national candidate. but the thing that people are responding to is that he is crystal clear about where he stands. he's been in the same place his whole career and that authenticity is a very rare commodity in politics. if you want to compare him to donald trump, there's nothing comparable in donald trump in terms of that sort of genuine authenticity. >> it's a big contrast with hillary clinton who is perceived -- >> absolutely right. >> i heard the argument made -- you talk about all the strengths hillary clinton has, the biggest front-runner either party has ever seen. that is actually a contrast. if there's one candidate who that contrast works for, it's bernie sanders because she represents so much of the entrenched power, the political class. it helps define him more to run against that. you talk about the generational difference on attitudes towards socialism, how much of that has to do with the older joe

bernie sanders is drawing crowds like nobody else. and donald trump is spiking to the top of the polls. what are the forces driving voters to give these two very different guys a l

but what bernie sanders is doing is not nothing. and bernie sanders is and always has been a completely unreconstructed, unapologetic, out loud, forceful liberal. and so if you are a liberal, the success that bernie sanders is achieving as a campaigner this year, it has to be heartening, right? i mean, you're not alone. the biggest crowds anybody is turning out in the presidential race on either side of the aisle are for the most liberal guy in the race by a mile. the most liberal guy to run, at least since dennis cue sinich. and i would like to see that fight. bernie might win. so maybe transactionally, what's going on in the campaign trail doesn't mean anything in terms of big scale electoral politics yet. but it means something in terms of the popularity of liberal ideas and ten thuz yachl for an unapologetically out loud liberal message. so maybe the beltway won't talk about it, but if you are a liberal, this feels good, right? and if you know some liberals, this is why they've been in a good mood. and if you know some liberals

some comments from her on bernie sanders and more. but first when we come back chris coons of delaware weighs in on the latest iran nuclear talks and so much more after this word from our sponsors. ♪ mark: our guest hails from the first state. chris coons, delaware senator. the iran nuclear negotiations continue. they extended a little bit. not unexpected. you have said you walk away from a bad deal. you only want a good deal. based on the issues that are being discussed now in terms of instructions sanctions, what are things that you think the tip it into some that would be a bad deal you? isenator coons: a bad deal is we would not get access to sites. a bad deal would be one where we did not have clarity about a path way toward accountability for iran's past or for military dimension of their illicit nuclear weapons program where the iaea did not have a commitment to interview scientists and inspect sites where we believe there was previous nuclear weapons derailment work. a bad deal would be one where we had no further clarity ab

bernie sanders with a thick brooklyn accent. rising more than the clinton campaign had handy anticipated. >> by all surprise. >> in case you didn't notice, this is a big turnout. >> and vermont senator bernie sanders is now generating huge crowds at nearly every event. last week at a rally in madison wisconsin, sanders attracted 10,000. >> the american people understand that establishment politics and establishment economics is not working for the middle class. >> the populace message is not only producing intrigue, it seems to be producing a sanders surge against hillary clinton. in early may poms suggested polls suggested 60% backed clinton and sanders was supported by 15.%. now he's up to 33. clinton's biggest wounds have been self-inflicted. >> as i said, i saw it as a matter of convenience. >> she faces continued questions about her reliance on a personal e-mail account as she served as secretary of state. and she has been dogged by revelations that groups and individuals who gave huge speaking fees to her husband received

. >>> will elizabeth warren endorse bernie sanders? chris christie tells matt lauer how he's doing with anger management and there's a huge enthusiasm gap between democrats and republicans about the presidential campaign. and democrats are on the wrong side of that gap. >>> presidential candidate ted cruz may not sound like a viable presidential candidate but he thinks he sounds like most of the characters on the simpsons. ted cruz will do his impression of simpson characters next. put your hand over your heart. is it beating? good! then my nutrition heart health mix is for you. it's a wholesome blend of peanuts, pecans and other delicious nuts specially mixed for people with hearts. i said people with hearts. because hearts health is important. that's why i've researched optimized and packaged this mix just for you. not you. so if you have a heart start optimizing your nutrition with my nutrition. planters. nutrition starts with nut. >>> buzzfeed decided to start to audition replacements. first up ted cruz. >> smithers, release the ho

bernie sanders comes to town. he's not a glad hander he goes up, he brings a message and lays it out there. and basically says look you're either going to buy it or you're not. what you see is what you get, what is the campaign strategy? i got a sense talking to bernie last night, i'm going to go from town to town and hopefully these crowds will translate into resources? what do you make of this strategy? >> well that's a good baseline strategy, it's not enough to get you anywhere near a nomination. there has to be more to and if we're frank about this we have to recognize that a passionate candidate who's speaking to core issues can draw a crowd, we know that to be the case the real question is, can you turn those crowds into folks who show up at caucuses caucuses have smaller turnout, but who do door to door and big energy and primary states. and my sense is the big deal of the last 24 hours from a newsstand point it was the madison event. take a look at what bernie sanders did this morning. he was up in rochest

bernie sanders for president. she wrote bernie appeared in the most unexpected of places and it made my day. bernie sanders, the independent socialist from vermont making his mark in deadhorse at the end of the dalton highway in the northern most reaches of oil town red state alaska. send it to rachel.com, the website if you want to send us stuff. >>> people first started realizing that something special, something unexpect was going on with the bernie sanders campaign when he turned out unusually large crowds in liberal strong holds like madison, wisconsin. this is a madison rally. turned out 11,000 people. in denver, colorado, he turned out between 5,000 and 6,000 people. they had to do an overflow room. in portland, maine, 8,000 people. they had to move the venue from a nice little waterfront spot to the hockey arena in town. when sanders announced his presidential run in burlington, vermont, there were 5,000 people there. that's a lot of people anywhere. no other candidate, democrat or republican turned out a

many of them concerning a gentleman named bernie sanders. that story next. >>> we sometimes forget what a slug fest they had back in 2008. now, technically back then there were eight candidates for the democratic presidential nomination. at least at one point. but very quickly it became a two-way contest. it was obama versus clinton. obama the insurgent. he struck first with a big win in iowa and then clinton bounced back in new hampshire. then she beat him again in nevada. at that point it looked at that moment like she was home free. she started out as the big front runner. she was establishment favorite. she took a hit and righted her ship and now she was rolling. that's how things had gone before. that's how it was supposed to play out again. hillary would coast to the nomination. this time back in 2008, something funny happened. the next primary after nevada was in south carolina. and in south carolina hillary clinton lost again. she lost big. she was crushed by obama. the margin was nearly two to one. it was more than two to one in fac

the issues bernie sanders wants to talk about desperately. running a serious campaign talking about serious solutions, can that be heard in our system? because to me the measure of democracy is whether our elections become vibrant debates. >> does the media try to attach themselves to sandsers? >> john nichols did a terrific piece about martin o'malley's proposal to restructure puerto rico's death. our columnist had a terrific column about why she is excited in supporting hillary clinton. >> interested in running the gamut. >> we're interested in hearing what hillary clinton has to say more with her economic speech. i think bernie sanders speaks to the prospects for progressive politics in this country. it is an opening. when you have a pope traveling to latin america talking about unfettered claptapitalism, perhaps we're now looking beyond labels. he is a new dealer. he is modernizing the new deal. people i think are hungry brian, not for opposition ads, and you know at the end of the day, the air waves -- this may be shocking although berni

the one standing up strong is bernie sanders. this is an issue where bernie and i are in complete agreement. we need to end the corporate welfare. far too much democrats and republicans are supporting hundreds of billions of dollars of loan guarantees to giant corporations at the expense of the taxpayers. i think people are fed up with that. they want someone who will stand with the working man and woman, against the bipart ann corruption of washington. >> is that a strategy on the right to build up bernie sanders? >> i've said for a long time, i like and almost bernie sanders. >> you're building him up. you took an opportunity. what is the strategy to build up bernie sanders from the right wing perspective? >> chris, chris, i respect honesty in politics. bernie admits he's a socialist. >> he is a socialist. you admit you are a tea party guy. it is a fact. that's not an admission. >> the difference is i think there are an awful lot of democrats in the united states senate whose policies are every bit as liberal or socialist but t

and that plays well to bernie sanders. number one because he's already been talking about it for many months, many years even. and number two, he's authentic about it. when he talks about it people feel it really resonates with him. you talk to hillary clinton's critics and they say they feel she can't relate to them for many of the reasons that people had critiques of mitt romney. she has charged huge numbers for speeches. she no longer can relate to the middle class. that's what this critique is. they can't say the same thing about bernie sanders. >> shira center and tara dowdell, thank you for your time tonight. >>> still ahead, details of why president obama decided to sing "amazing grace" and what the first lady said about it. s are you still getting heartburn flare-ups? time for a new routine. try nexium® 24hr. the latest choice for frequent heartburn. get complete protection. nexium level protection. ♪ amazing grace ♪ how sweet the sound that saved a wretch like me ♪ >> president obama singing "amazing grace"

what's behind the bernie sanders surge? >> well i tell you what's behind him is a lot of dissatisfaction in the democratic party with hillary clinton. >> what's behind that? >> what's behind that is that in 2008 the democratic left took control of the party from the clinton machine. which owned the democratic party. >> in the person of barack obama. >> in the person of barack obama. and they over the last six or so years, have come to run the democratic party. they do not trust bill or hillary clinton. they think that they will put one foot in wall street and one foot in the big money, which they have and they will not represent left wing the left policy agenda. and elizabeth warren was going to be their original standard-bearer. she said i'm not going there and bernie sanders stepped forward and all of these disaffected left wing democrats, for the moment getting behind bernie sanders. >> how worried should hillary clinton be by the sadrers challenge? >> i don't think she has anything to worry about. he doesn't have the es

bernie sanders, $15 million, also impressive. coming up, more excerpts from heidi: very impressive that the self-described socialist out raised carly fiorina. mark: coming up, more excerpts from the hillary clinton first national television interview. some comments from her on bernie sanders and more. but first when we come back, chris coons of delaware weighs in on the latest iran nuclear talks and so much more after this word from our sponsors. ♪ mark: our guest hails from the first state. chris coons, delaware senator. thank you for coming to join us. the iran nuclear negotiations continue. they have delayed until later in the week. they extended a little bit. not unexpected. you have said you walk away from a bad deal. you only want a good deal. based on the issues that are being discussed now in terms of instructions, sanctions, what are things that you think the tip it into some that would be a bad deal you? senator coons: a bad deal is we didn't have any confidence that we would be able to get access to sites in iraq, mi

. >>> will elizabeth warren endorse bernie sanders? chris christie tells matt lauer how he's doing with anger management and there's a huge enthusiasm gap between democrats and republicans about the presidential campaign. and democrats are on the wrong side of that gap. >>> presidential candidate ted cruz may not sound like a viable presidential candidate but he thinks he sounds like most of the characters on "the simpsons." ted cruz will do his impression of simpson characters next. fact. advil is not only strong it's gentle on your body too. no wonder doctors and patients have trusted advil... for their tough pains for over 30 years. relief doesn't get any better than this. advil. you owned your car for four years. you named it brad. you loved brad. and then you totaled him. you two had been through everything together. two boyfriends. three jobs. you're like "nothing can replace brad!" then liberty mutual calls. and you break into your happy dance. if you sign up for better car replacement, we'll pay for a car that's a model year ne

including more with bernie sanders and our panel. stay with us we'll also have look back at bush and clinton through the years. >> dickerson: welcome back. we continue our conversation with vermont independent senator bernie sanders. septor, you mentioned that you agree with the pope on climate change question. do you agree with him on his harsh condemnation of capitalism? >> i think what the pope has been saying in a very profound and deep way is that casino-type capitalism is closing devastating problems not only in terms of our climate but in terms of income and wealth equality. he talks about the fact that all over the world, for example, we are ignoring the need for senior citizens and around the world don't have the money they need for medicine. heat their homes or eat the food, buy the food that they need to survive. he has talked about an issue, john, that i am talking about a lot. and that is young people throughout the world in our country today we have youth unemployment for white kids who graduate high school of 33% hispa

this campaign is not about bernie sanders. it is not about hillary clinton. it is not about anybody else. it is about you! [ cheers and applause ] >> joining us now the campaign manager for the bernie sanders campaign. jeff, i have heard a lot of theories about why the polls on bernie sanders should be discounted. new hampshire polls should be discounted because he lives next door in vermont. and now the theory on iowa polls, national polls is some people are saying all of these people are saying they are voting for bernie so send a message to hillary. i haven't met poll respondents who answered poll questions strategically in order to send messages to candidates they are going to vote for by saying they will vote for others. what is your reaction to what's happening to bernie sanders in the polls and the crowds he's attracting and how you turn that in to votes? >> well i mean what is incredible is eight weeks ago he was not a candidate for president. before eight weeks we have had 5,000 people in burlington. that's his home city. 5,000 people in minneapolis,

>> bernie sanders has been a good democrat. caucuses with the democrats. >> she speak in prime time? with everybody watching? >> bernie sanders represents, we are a big time -- >> so the answer is yes. >> i said yes. i can say yes again. >> in prime time. >> i don't know what time he should speak. >> maybe when nobody is watching, you mean. >> no. of course he should speak. he should speak in a slot where the appeal that he has across the board, the progressive, pop list message that he has that resonates deeply and widely with the american people, not just democrats, absolutely that should be featured. the difference between us and the republicans, we are really a big party. >>> whatever is the difference between a democrat and a socialist? i used to think there is a big difference. what do you think it is? >> the difference between -- >> a democrat like hillary and a socialist between bernie sanders. what's the big difference between a democrat and a socialist? you're chairman of the democratic party. tell me the difference.

bernie sanders however, gets to the nub of the problem. supposition position that the majority of americans -- increasing taxes on the very rich. i do not think you can address the defining crisis of our time without taking that up. i know it is heretical, but the nation covered this years ago. president dwight eisenhower had a 90% margin tax rate on the wealthy. no one is calling for that now because we have moved into an era where we are trying to recalibrate after the you roshan -- erosion of the safety net after years of largely republican assault. i think hillary clinton's address has interesting ideas but i do not think she will talk as firmly as bernie sanders about the importance of taking on banks to big to fail, making sure they are responsible to the real economy, that they are not defrauding, criminalizing the economy in which they have been blessed to work. host: michelle in wisconsin democrat. good morning. caller: thank you for taking my call. i was calling because i do like bernie sanders. he is upfront. he wants to take on

bernie sanders is drawing crowds like nobody else. and donald trump is spiking to the top of the polls. what are the forces driving voters to give these two very different guys a look and perhaps even a vote? election season has begun, certainly and that's for sure. people are looking for someone left or right to show some guts. robert costas, the front page political reporter on the "washington post." joan walsh is editor at large with salon. our new program shows bernie sanders is gaining momentum. according to the poll, hillary clinton still leads 52% to 33%. but since may, clinton has lost 8 points while sanders has picked up 18 points. yesterday, a convincing crowd of 10,000 people packed the vets memorial coliseum in wisconsin where sanders played the part of progressive pop star. >> what this campaign is about is creating a political revolution in america. the greed of corporate america and the billionaire class has got to end. and we are going to end it for them. this is not democracy. this is oligarchy and we've got to end it