after our meeting with president alinsky besar volker and i traveled to the frontline in northern dom boss to receive a briefing from the commander of forces on the line of contact arriving for the briefing in the military headquarters the commander thanked us for the security systems but i was aware that this is systems was on hold which may be uncomfortable besar volker and i could see the armed and hostile rus russian led forces on the other side of the damaged bridge across the line of contact russian led forces continue to kill ukraine's in the war one or 2 a week or more ukrainians would undoubtedly die without the us assistance although i spent the morning of july 26th with president alinsky and other ukrainian officials the 1st summary of the july 25th from zelinsky call that i heard from anybody inside the u.s. government was during a phone call i had with jim morrison dr hill's recent replacement at the n.s.c. on july 28th mr morrison told me that the call could have been better and that president trump had suggested that presence of linsky or his staff meet with mr giuliani

administration and personally reaching out to presidents alinsky and his senior team silence newfound assertiveness also concerned dr hill who previously had enjoyed a cordial working relationship with the ambassador on june 18th 2019 hill had a blow up with saul and when he told her that he was in charge of ukraine policy dr hill testified that saddam got testy with me and i said who has put you in charge of it he said the president. on july 10th dr hill was part of a meeting at the white house with a group of u.s. and ukrainian officials including bolton sunland and energy secretary perry another of the 3 amigos the meeting was intended among other things to give the ukrainians an opportunity to convey that they were anxious to set up a meeting a 1st meeting between their new president and president trump someone interjected to inform the group that according to white house chief of staff mick mulvaney white house meeting sought by the ukrainian president would trump what happened if you crane undertook certain investigations hearing this bolton abruptly ended the meeting undeterred

told the rest of the participants that he was planning to have a conversation with presidents alinsky 'd in toronto in 3 days or days. where he would. outline for present linsky the the 'd important components of the phone call that we were trying to establish ok and you didn't have any issue with that. the only issue i had with that mr custer was. there was reference. to investigations in i believe that's evolved to check my notes on that but that there was over raised issues for me that i didn't understand what about the revoke i had in mind that he was specifically going to raise with mrs alinsky but that was a little bit of a concern ok. and the president's express is you know interest in certain investigations is certainly relating to the 26000 election and relating to even this corrupt. outfit so that was inconsistent with the president's message right. i'm not sure i'm sketchy maybe i can ask you to repeat the question the the president's concerns about the 26000 election and need to get to the bottom of it and the the president's concerns is that ultimately related to the the

with ukrainian counterparts for this reason i've been present in many of the meetings with presidents alinsky and his administration some of which may be germane to this inquiry while i'm a political counselor at the embassy it is important to know that i am not a political appointee or engage in u.s. politics in any way it is not my job to cover or advise on u.s. politics on the contrary i'm in a political foreign policy professional and my job my job is to focus on the politics of the country in which i serve so that we can better understand the local landscape and better advance u.s. national interests there in fact during the period that will cover today my colleagues and i follow direct guidance for a mastery of on of it and ambassador taylor to focus on doing our jobs as foreign policy professionals and to stay clear of washington politics. i arrived in kiev to take up my assignment as political counsellor in august 2017 a year after ambassador you want to receive her appointment from august 27th scene until a removal from post in may 2019 i was in battery of on of it as chief policy ad

how important to presidents alinsky was a white house meeting. w leaders, particularly countries i have good footing in the year, the tional arena. see a meeting with the us president in the oval office at the white house as ace as the ultimate sign of endosement and support from the united states. president zelenskyy was a relatively new president is that right. that's correct. he was elected on on april 21th and his was ormed after elections in july. what a white house meeting r president zelensky boost his legitimacy as new president and ukraine it would primarily boost his leverage to negotiate with vl dimir putin abo the russian occupaion of 7% of ukrainian territory. mr. kan is is pressuring ukrai to conduct what i lie you've called political investigations. a part ofs foreign policy to promote the rule of law in ukine and around the world. it is not. is it in the national interest of the united states in my opinion it is not. particularly in promoting the rule of law. designed to help countries an eastern. that is overcoming the legacy of

when he talked about how many times have you met presidents alinsky. i think it was just the one time from the presidential delegation multiple engagements but just the one trip and that's a one on one meeting that was in a bilateral larger bilateral format. than there was there were a couple of smaller venue they were all in up and there was never a one on one. but there were a couple of against again touch points so the bilateral meeting handshake meeting very high she had a short so there was a lot of people in the room yeah when when you know that with them this congress you still advise ukrainian president to watch out for the russians yes and that was that was and that and everybody else in the room i'm assuming the national security adviser was there i believe in this case you had other members of the ministration was that what your points preapproved did they know you are going to bring up those points i did we did have a huddle beforehand and it's possible i flagged him but i don't i don't recall specifically possible date i didn't and you cou

in warsaw during which alinsky raised this is spent in security assistance following that meeting someone approached the senior ukrainian officials to tell him that he believed what could help them move the aid was if the ukrainian prosecutor general would go to the mike and announce that he was opening the barisan investigation. someone told taylor that he had made a mistake by telling ukrainians that an oval office meeting was dependent on a public announcement of investigations in fact everything was dependent on such an announcement including security assistance but even the announcement by the prosecutor general would not satisfy the president on september 7th someone spoke to the president and told to morrison and bill taylor about the call shortly thereafter the president said that although this was not a quid pro quo if president selenski did not clear things up in public we would be at a stalemate or over announcement by the prosecutor general would not be enough presidents alinsky must personally once announce personally that he would open the investigations someone told taylor

backtracking just a little bit on july 3rd you met in toronto with president alinsky and there's been some. you know him better tailor and mr kant provided some testimony that they had some apprehension that the part of this year irregular channel that taylor referenced would rear its head in toronto and i'm just wondering if you can tell us. whether that in fact happened yes thank you. i can only tell you what what i know and there may have been other conversations or other things but i know that we had a conversation bill taylor and i believe gordon salma and i around the 28th of june that later connected to a believe a conversation with president alinsky although i may not have been part of the latter. that being said i was convinced after that conversation we had gotten nowhere we had our white house briefing of president trump on may 23rd he signed a letter inviting presence on ski to the white house on may 29th and for several weeks we were just temporizing with the ukrainians saying well we're working on it it's a scheduling issue you know we'll get there don't worry and i told

domestic policy in politics politics why did you feel was necessary to advise presidents alinsky to stay away from us. domestic politics our chairman in the march and april timeframe became clear that there were. there were actors in the us public public actors non-governmental actors that were. promoting the idea of investigations and 2016 ukrainian interference and it see it was consistent with u.s. policy to advise any country all the countries in my portfolio any country in the in the world to not participate in u.s. domestic politics so i was passing the same advice consistent with u.s. policy i know mr goldman will have more questions about that when i turn to him but let me turn if i can to the hold on security assistance which i think you both testified you learned about in early july am i correct that neither of you were with provided with a reason for why the president put a hold on security assistance to ukraine my understanding was that o.m.b. was reviewing the assistance to ensure it was in line with an instruction priorities but it was not made more specific than that kerma

said that if presidents alinsky did not clear things up in public we would be at a stalemate he and. a he began that again by repeating this is not a quid pro quo but if the pres if presents and he did not clear things up in public we would be at a stalemate and what i understood for in that meeting the meaning of stalemate was the security systems would not come so even though he said the words there were no quid pro quo he then went on to say but the security systems will not come unless these investigations are done is that you have what you're saying mind staying that's what was meant by stalemate you also describe in your opening statement a discussion you had about president trump being a businessman who wanted to have people pay up before signing the check and what is what did you understand that to me this was an explanation that that bess or someone gave me about his understanding of president trump's thought process. investor someone is a businessman and as an trump's a businessman and he was explaining to me. the. relationship the understanding that that a businessman woul

homesteads alinsky wanted an oval office meeting with trump but it was made clear that the linsky would wouldn't get the meeting unless he announced on c.n.n. that ukraine was investigating joe biden this was a demand the president's a lansky personally commit on a cable news channel to a specific investigation of president trump's political rival holmes testified he also had a clear impression that a hold on u.s. military aid was likely intended by trump to pressure ukraine for the investigation home said he overheard a phone call between trump and ambassador some land discussing whether his alinsky would cooperate so you heard president trump ask ambassador son when is he going to do the investigation yes or. what was ambassador sundin's response he said oh yeah he's going to do it he'll do anything us that earn homes and this rebuke from republican congressman mike turner your statements that your interests are protecting ukraine are very dubious when you embarrass president zelinsky by making those statements even have to make who cares that investor someone said who cares that ques

you would agree that if presidents alinsky contradicted president trump and said of course i felt pressured they were holding up 400000000 in military assistance we have people dying every day if he were to contradict president directly they would be sophisticated enough to know they may pay a very heavy price with this president were they not that's a fair assessment. and presidents let's get not only had to worry about retribution from donald trump should he contradict on the trump publicly he also has to worry about how he's perceived domestically doesn't the investor taylor president is very sensitive to the views of ukrainian people who indeed are very attentive to ukraine and u.s. politics yes and so if president selenski were to say i had to capitulate and agree to these investigations i was ready to go on c.n.n. until the age got restored that would obviously be hurtful to him back home would it not he cannot afford to be seen to be deferring to any any foreign leader there he is very confident in his own abilities and he's and he knows that ukrainian people expect him to do to be c

holmes was meeting with his alinsky as a follow up he said that the president of ukraine said 3 times that trump had brought up sensitive information on this call sensitive issues were his words that which he later understood meant these investigations into biden and then afterwards as the u.s. officials were sitting down for a light inch he was surprised holmes says because some when the ambassador to the e.u. pulled out his phone and in the middle of a lunch on a patio restaurant in kiev he dialed the number for the president of the united states and this is what holmes said he overheard. basser silence phone was not on speaker phone i could hear the president's voice through the ear piece of the phone the president's voice was loud and recognizable and a better song and held the phone away from his ear for a period of time presumably because of the loud volume i heard a bass or song and greet the president and explain he was calling from kiev i heard president trump and clarify that a better song was in ukraine vasser song replied yes he was in ukraine and went on to state the pres

vaster song replied that he's going to do it adding the president's alinsky will do anything you ask him to do. and then in fact according to holmes testimony the conversation with solomon would further and someone said to holmes that the president doesn't give an expletive about ukraine that he only cares about the quote big stuff and holmes says and he said well the big stuff when that mean the war that ukraine is fighting against russia which you know has national security stakes for the united states and someone's response was no not that stuff the big stuff for the president are these investigations that he hoped would help him politically ok maybe based on what we've seen in the last few days when as i said when the recess and everyone gets back to the hearing room it'll be time for the. ranking member part of the newness to to start his questioning based on what we seen what do you think we can expect from the republicans in the line of questioning particularly since dr fiona hill has said a lot of the conspiracy theories that have been al fair about ukraine just aren't true a

presidents alinsky and senior u.s. officials write starts with the call starts with a call with president trump and presents alinsky the next day you meet with presidents linsky in ukraine then we have a master bold meeting with theme then we have vice president pens meet with theme then we have u.s. senators johnson and murphy meet with him and guess what in none of those meetings not a single one security assistance dollars in exchange for an investigation not once did they come up to that event did that conversation come up is that right i described not once no discussion of aid for investigations and as you testified you never believe a fair investigation was ever being talked about either in any of these conversations that is correct but what happened in those meetings they all became convinced of the same thing you knew they all solve the same darn thing this guy was the real deal he is a legitimate reformer and they all came back they all came back and told the president mr president this guy's real go ahead rel

ambassador to the ease you and he explicitly told when his alinsky say that there was yet another thing in exchange for the investigations into joe biden and that indeed was the security aide now this afternoon we're expecting to hear something a bit different her volcker who is the former envoy to ukraine he is a bit of a wild card when he testified behind closed doors previously he said he didn't make the connection that that aid and the investigations were at all linked however he is the person who was tasked with bringing in the president's personal attorney rudy giuliani into the picture and it was also kurt volker himself who suggested the wording of the statement that trump wanted from ukraine. in which it was going to have it explained to the public that it was investigating joe biden and it was volcker who said that the statement had to include the name of the company on which joe biden's son was once a chairman so all wishes is to say that volcker could be a pivotal witness the republicans are hoping that he will continue to defend the president this afternoon however he has b

other side of that line to the white house is called up in his side of the events of a lot of me as alinsky has much more attention from the u.s. than he ever wanted right now we ask how ukraine gate looks seen from kiev and see what's at stake there. we had. i think good phone call it was normal we spoke about many things and. so i think when you're ready that nobody bullshit bullshit me yes no credit. no pressure on ukraine to launch an investigation into trump rival joe biden's son hunter that's a claim that since been challenged by numerous top u.s. officials testifying to congress irrespective of whether this ends in impeachment to trump what does this mean for his visibly uncomfortable guest polygamous lenski and the country elite. as worrying is ukraine gate is for ukraine's leaders in the streets of the capital kiev it's barely making waves most people a struggling to understand just what trump is accused of wanting from celeste. you'd have to ask trump what it is he wanted to be honest i don't have a clue on their noses and probably wanted to make ukraine join nato and the e.u. . h

is in your opinion your interactions with prisons alinsky is he a straight shooter is he a liar or is. he impressed me greatly and that's why i wanted to get he and president trump together as soon as possible and so when he makes express statements tend to believe them with my limited interaction with him he seems very honorable thank you mr ambassador i hope you make it your plane thank you mr i yield back was castro thank you chairman good afternoon investor welcome others close to president trump have made it clear that investigations were in fact part of the conditions for u.s. assistance to ukraine including rudy giuliani and mick mulvaney the acting chief of staff so messer silence at a press conference on october 17th acting white house chief of staff mick mulvaney discussed his belief that it's entirely appropriate to politicize u.s. foreign policy ambassador how often did you speak or meet with mr moving. again based on my lack of records i'm going by a bad memory just based on your memory i only think i had one formal meeting with mr mulvaney and i had nothing to do with uk

the telephone call that they both listened in to between donald trump and the ukrainian president as alinsky they used words such as improper and unusual and i actually took that further we'll return to that as soon as we come back joseph euro is with us at the moment discussing this further we might break a wife that starts joseph but i want to go back to something that devon is said again and this is been a tactic from the republicans hasn't it to cast this in his words as a shariah aid they want to muddy the waters it's a witch hunt how effective is that at least in the public's mind do you think well for people who are predisposed to be supporters of the president to be critical of the democrats and this investigation that kind of talk you know certainly. reinforces their preconceived notions to the extent that american public opinion is deeply polarized extremely partisan in these days and he has a talk along those lines may or may simply act to solidify people in their preconceived views rather than have them approach these hearings with an open mind what difference do you think it's g

any ukrainians had acted inappropriately at this time i was focused on our goal of getting presents alinsky and president trump to meet with each other and i believe that they're doing so would overcome the chronically negative view president trump had toward ukraine i was seeking to solve the problem i saw when we met with president trump in the oval office on may 23rd as a professional diplomat i was comfortable exploring whether there was a statement ukraine could make about its own intentions to investigate possible corruption that would be helpful and given seeing mr giuliani to convey to president trump a more positive assessment of the new leadership in ukraine on august 16th mr year mark shared a draft with me which i thought looked perfectly reasonable it did not mention breeze month or 2016 elections but was generic a better song london and i had a further conversation with mr giuliani who said that in his view in order to be convincing that this government represented real change in ukraine the statement should include specific reference to breeze and 2016 again there was no ment

you've testified that the white house meeting the president's alinsky desperately wanted and that was very important to presidents alinsky was it not absolutely you testified that that meeting was conditioned was a quid pro quo for what the president wanted these 2 investigations and that right correct and that everybody knew it correct. now that white house meeting was going to be an official meeting between the 2 presidents correct presumably it would be an oval office meeting hopefully a working meeting yes working meeting so an official act got wrecked. and in order to perform that official act donald trump one of these 2 investigations that would help his reelection campaign correct i can't characterize why he wanted them all i can tell you is this is what we heard from mr giuliani but he had he had to get those 2 investigations if that official act was going to take place correct he had to announce the investigations he didn't actually have to do them as i understood it ok as insolence he had to announce 2 investigations the president want to make a public announcement correct c

do we know what officials within those alinsky regime he actually met with i know to a gentleman named by your mack who was one as alinsky s senior advisors and then we also know of the former attorney general on that we've already established here the we didn't was corrupt. and mr luzhin go served under zelinsky for a couple of months up until april i missed going to august is that correct that's right and their parliament basically voted him out is that correct yes that's right . so if rudy giuliani. is trying to influence the zelinsky regime was a guy that worked under the previous regime under porsche enco be the right guy to do it. so are you saying mr le tanka yes he could you did mr hussein go have much credibility within the zelinsky regime the current the current regime i don't think so he didn't he didn't and i missed your back to do you know of any other ukrainians that mr giuliani was meeting with that was part of the selenski regime. which is to remind i would've already have left by that point but there was a line not only even with the administration to come right selens

gordon sunland who told and ukrainian aid it does alinsky that there was another explicit quid pro quo that in order to get the white house meeting with his own skin trump and the u.s. security a to ukraine that ukraine would need to deliver those investigations into joe biden now trump has denied that the aide and the investigations were tied and republicans have focused on attacking the process of this impeachment inquiry and also trying to out the identity of the whistleblower that led to this exchange between ranking member devon junia's and then men in which the union is trying to tease out information about the whistleblower. you're here to answer questions and you're here under subpoena. so you can either answer the question or you can plead the 5th on behalf of my client we are following the rules of the committee rule of the chair with regard to this issue and this does not call for an answer that is invoking the 5th or any theoretical issue like that the following ruling of the chair what chance or what ruling is that i can interject counsel is correct whistleblower has the r

as was alinsky they urged trump to meet with the ukrainian president but trump instead criticize ukraine and instructed them to work with judy root work with rootie a few weeks later on july 10th and basta sonnen met at the white house with a group of u.s. and ukrainian officials including colonel van men and form the group that according to chief of staff will veiny the white house meeting sought by the ukrainian president would trump what happened if ukraine undertook certain investigations national security adviser bolton abruptly ended the meeting and said afterwards that he would not be part of whatever drug deal song and will veiny are cooking up on this undeterred the song that brought the ukrainian delegation downstairs to another part of the white house and was more explicit according to witnesses ukraine needed to investigate the bidens or bryza if they were to get a white house meeting with trump after this discussion which women witnessed he went to the national security council's top lawyer to report the matter then was told to return in the future with any concerns. he woul

mister talansky presence alinsky through. the steps that need to be taken in order to get to the phone call. and you testified earlier that the 6 security assistance had already been frozen to your knowledge. at least 5 july 18 is tt right that's correct so that was just a week earlier than this is corre. so just so we're clear investor taylor before this july 25th call. security assistance that uaine needed. at the white house meeting s condition ukraine initiating this investigation and that had been relayed to the ukrainian ys that an act state of play at this time that's yours to play the eye at that point had no indication. any discussion of of the surity assistance being. subject to condition box conditioned on the investigations, taken place. but younderstood that the white house meeting. that's corre. alright, let's move ahead to this july 25th call. and between the presidents now am i about that neither of you were this call is that right mister kent. so you both read it after it was a released publicly at the end of

somehow embarrass presidents alinsky i haven't the deepest respect for presidents alinsky this is a guy this is a guy of jewish background from and soviet industrial suburb in southern ukraine who made himself one of most popular dinners in the country and somehow got elected president and he's not going to miss that opportunity this is a ukrainian patriot this is a tough guy and frankly he was stood a lot of pressure for a very long time. and he didn't give that interview i have a deepest respect for him ukrainian people also have the deepest respect for him they've chosen him to help deliver the full measure of promise of their revolution of dignity and i think all our respect thank you mr chairman i ask unanimous consent to enter the may 27th photograph depicted on the screen into the record without objection mr heard. thank you dr hill mr holmes for years years of service to this country and i appreciate you being here today throughout this process i have said that i want to learn the facts so we can get to the truth so why are we here because of 2 things that occurred during the pr

as well and obviously he understood but what was happening we've got a brand new guy in ukraine this alinsky guy wins right right his party takes over and president trump wants to see with all these other things that are of concern to him we want to see if this you guys actually as i like to say the real deal a real reformer and actually going to deal with the corruption problem so it gets held up for 55 days gets held up on june 18th just gives me july 18th and then is released on september 11th but it seems to me more important in the 55 day pause is the 14 days when ukraine realized aid was held up on the 29th we've now had you testified that the 2 witnesses yesterday testified that the politico article so a gets held up on august scuse me ukraine learns aid is held on august 29th and then of course released on. released on september 11th in those 14 days there are 3 important meetings with senior government officials and presidents olinsky as the august 29th meeting between bester bolton and president linsky there's the meeting september 1st that you're a part of vice president pence mee

the president's alinsky himself had to clear things up clear things up and do it in public unquote. president trump there was no quid pro quo, he also made it clear to you in that car. presidents lynskey had to quote clear things up and do it in public. you never reason to dispute that i don't have any reason to dispute the clear things up and do it in public. what i'm trying to be very clear about was president trump never told me directly that the aid was tied to that state but in that same conversation you had with him about the aid about the quid pro quo, he told you the president's alinsky had to quote clear things up and do it in public or i did not have a conversation with him about the 8 i had a conversation with him as referenced in my text about quid pro quo. well, the quid pro quo you're discussing was over the 8 correct. when i asked him the open ended question as i testified previously, what do you want from ukraine his answer was i want nothing i want no quid pro quo tells alinsky to do the right thing that's all i got from. did you also get from president trump is ref

on september 5th i took notes as senator johnson and senator chris murphy meetings with presidents alinsky and chief were present selenski asked about the security assistance although both senators stressed strong bipartisan congressional support for ukraine senator johnson cautioned president's alinsky that president trump has a negative view of ukraine and that president selenski would have a difficult time overcoming center johnson further explained that he had been quote shocked by president trump's negative reaction during an oval office meeting on may 23rd when he in the 3 amigos propose that president trump meet president selenski and show support for ukraine on september 8th ambassador taylor told me quote now they're insisting zelinsky commit to the investigation in an interview with c.n.n. which i took to refer to this 3 amigos i was shocked the requirement was so specific and concrete all we had advisor ukrainian counterparts. to voice a commitment to following the rule of law and generally investigating credible corruption allegations this was a demand that president selenski p

that i was going to give presidents alinsky. and i was going to call president zelensky and ask him to say what is in this e-mail i was asking essentially president pompeo is permission to do that. which he said yes. but but but that at that point in time we're talking about investigations into into the origins of the 2016 election and we're not talking about anything to do with joe biden. joe biden did not come up. stepping back a page to year. your e-mail to the state department on august 11th. you're e-mail secretary and you say curtain, i negotiated a statement from zaleski to be delivered from review a day or 2. here is that i mean that statement never was issued and in fact ambassador volker has testified that he didn't think it was a good idea and ultimately the ukrainians didn't think it was a good idea and said that the statement never reached a. finalized. even if it had it it doesn't talk about biden's river or anything in city us. well the statement as as i recall would have mentioned the 2016 election slash dnc serv

made a mistake by earlier telling ukrainian officials that only a white house meeting with presidents alinsky was dependent on a public announcement of investigations in fact about solomon said everything was dependent on such an announcement including security systems he said the president trump wanted presents alinsky in a public box by making a public statement about ordering such investigations the member of my staff could hear president trump on the phone asking ambassador solomon about the investigations. assignment told president trump the ukrainians were ready to move forward following the call with president trump the member of my staff asked investor solomon what president trump thought about ukraine as a song the respondent the president from cares more about the investigations of biden which giuliani was pressing for this judgment i mean that testimony is certainly damning for the u.s. president but have we reached that moment where we can say as it as they said in the 1970 is that there is a cancer on the presidency have we gotten there yet you know are definitely there is no que

homesteads alinsky wanted an oval office meeting with trump but it was made clear that the linsky would wouldn't get the meeting unless he announced on c.n.n. that ukraine was investigating joe biden this was a demand that president selenski personally commit on a cable news channel to a specific investigation of president trump's political rival homes testified he also had a clear impression that a hold on u.s. military aid was likely intended by trump to pressure ukraine for the investigation holmes said he overheard a phone call between trump and ambassador some land discussing whether his alinsky would cooperate so you heard president trump ask ambassador son when is he going to do the investigation yes or. what was ambassador sunless response he said oh yeah he's going to do it he'll do anything you ask that urn homes of this rebuke from republican congressman mike turner your statements that your interest of protecting ukraine are very dubious when you embarrass president zelinsky by making those statements even have to make who cares that investor someone said who cares that ques

based on your recollection ambassador volcker who within this alinsky regime had as mayor giuliani interacted with now in addition to mr your mac which we've already talked about and also the former attorney general mr the shank oh you know i don't know who else he would have interacted with the in this of linsky government i am aware of him having claimed that he met with mr lott sankoh those predecessor as prosecutor general now but that's not within that's not it was a lady on that whitman which in which we're all we're talking about a daughter who else he would have met with and as few words as possible what was your understanding of ambassador sohn in ukraine he cared about ukraine he wanted to see us support of ukraine increased he wanted to see european union support for ukraine increased including maintenance of sanctions and he wanted to be helpful wasn't bassus on having conversations with seniors on ski officials without letting other people know i don't believe that he was not letting people know i think he may have had some conversations but i think he was just. acting you know a

coming up now and bill taylor today confirmed to me a meeting a potential meeting between trump and alinsky as well as military aides hundreds of millions of dollars were in fact conditioned to such investigations that would be a quid pro quo and that in fact would be a betrayal of president tom's oath of office that's at least the line here that the democrats and chairman adam schiff are following here the big question of course will be do the voters see that as well the voters in the entire world watching these hearings which began today and people were expecting to see somewhat of a partisan fight if you will going on and you were inside the chamber there where the hearing was taking place i mean what was the atmosphere like today. well the atmosphere was quite a sober one but of course the republicans are under enormous pressure and you could feel that here today in the hearings and the run up there was a memo circulated addressed to republican house members where they blind out the strategy of their defense and that was basically to say that the president did do nothing wrong and then

mr holmes you testified just as venom and said kernel of him and said that he warns alinsky about getting involved in u.s. politics you don't question that they didn't take issue with that so why smear this purple heart recipient just like this mayor of a vast array of audit it's just gratuitous i don't question the facts it's just gratuitous the attack on you mr holmes that you were indiscreet and mention this conversation to others well i think you're quite right the indiscretion is when an ambassador u.u. a cause the president out in secure a line in a country known for russian telecommunications and eavesdropping that's more than indiscretion that's a security risk but why attack you mr holmes they don't question anything you said in question what conversation you overheard and bastard saw online indeed didn't question what you said he had knowledge that the one thing the president wanted to know the day after that conversation was alinsky was is he going to do the investigations and so on and said yes he'll do anything you ask they don't question that so why attack you they didn't qu

and the steps that actually a real peace in the area this is all been initiated again by presidents alinsky the new president in ukraine and moscow has to have good positive contacts with vilinsky there has been some phone calls between president putin and zelinsky but there as or is also some reluctance to because they're all there is concern that as alinsky doesn't have enough power in his own country there are also opposing forces against this peace process the a lot of people in ukraine say this is a capital a sion to russia russia will still dominate this area sort of the ball is now in a court of moscow to decide are they going to agree to sit together with ukraine france and germany to sort out this peace process. now u.s. airstrikes against an armed group al-shabaab in somalia have surged since 2017 following an executive order by president donald trump and civilians living in the . area of course in the crossfire international says a growing number of people have been killed and dozens more injured now webb spoke to some of the survivors here. on the shoulder as ripped open by a bl

fully in washington public the committee is still focusing on the coal from trump to the president's alinsky is this cold going to be the smoking gun in this impeachment process. hi anthony well it certainly looks like it because of course you know a lot of the session today has been basically centered around this july 25th phone call between president trump and the ukrainian president. because of course we're hearing from 2 witness who actually 2 witnesses who actually listened in to that call you know as we've seen in the report there you know lieutenant colonel alexander vin you know he's a decorated iraq war veteran he was born in ukraine he moved to the united states as a as a young child sort of the american dream someone who can be trusted he was listening into that call as i said on the 25th of july and he said that he was concerned by trump's demands and he said it was inappropriate and also weren't you're going to air here quite a lot over the course of today and we've been certainly airing it several times and he said that he reported his concerns to the white house's national sec

this ends in impeachment to trump what does this mean for his visibly uncomfortable guest polygamous alinsky and the country elite. as worrying is ukraine gate is for ukraine's leaders in the streets of the capital kiev it's barely making waves most people are struggling to understand just what trump is accused of wanting insolence to. you'd have to ask trump what it is he wanted to be honest i don't have a clue on their noses and probably wanted to make ukraine join nato and the e.u. . has this to translate it for the 3 but it trump has his reelection to think about. and selenski really wants to be friends with world leaders that's why he caved in. the unpleasant little book of it you would have seen as far away as the so-called ukraine scandal might feel to ordinary ukrainians this is clearly about more than just making friends with world leaders $400000000.00 in military aid to be precise dependent on presence alliance his willingness to launch an investigation into trump opponent joe biden's son hunter so the allegation goes in ukraine's 5 year conflict with russia u.s. military assistan

there's a we're talk about presence alinsky no president from president is russia corrupt country yes it is and president trump has met a number of times in person with president putin is that right yes a few times and he's had a number of phone calls with president putin is that right this is turkey a corrupt country yes i believe so and just last week despite their corruption at the white house president aired a long had an audience with the present united states that correct as he did finally. mr giuliani on may 9th told the new york times president trump basically knows what i'm doing as his lawyer are you familiar with that statement to the new york times or not but you agree that someone has a lawyer sitting next to you at a lawyer x. on a client's behalf and only on a client's behalf is that right i believe that a lawyer acts on his client's behalf i.

fishel acts we're talking about here are a white house meeting the president's alinsky desperately sought and as you have acknowledged investor volker was deeply important to this country at war with russia to show the united states having this new presidents back that meeting was important that meeting is an official act the military assistance is even more significant because ukrainians are dying every day in their war with russia and so the withholding a military assistance to get these investigations which you now have a knowledge of vaster volcker was wrong for the president to request the idea withholding that military aid to get these political investigations should be anathema to it repugnant to every american because it means the sacrifice not just of ukrainian national security but american national security for the interests of the president personally and politically my part republican colleagues all they seem to be upset about with this is not that the president saw an investigation of his political rival not that he withheld the white house meeting and $400000000.00 in aid w

i mean july was becoming clear to me that the meeting president alinsky wanted was condition on the investigations of barista and alicia crane interference in the 26000 us elections it was also clear that this condition was driven by the irregular policy channel i'd come to understand was guided 'd by mr giuliani rudy giuliani stand up and. that's donald trump's personal lawyer and embassador taylor says mr giuliani was involved in an unofficial communication channel that was unaccountable to congress and was involved in pressuring ukraine. president trump dismissed the inquiry i'm too busy to watch it it's a witch charge it's a hoax if you missed the hearings on wednesday the president will get another chance to watch on friday that's when a former u.s. ambassador to ukraine and the state department official a due to take the stand. our let's get more on a historic day in d.c. let's bring in deed of use all of our salat he was at today's hearing on capitol hill now all over the 1st impeachment hearing in more than 2 decades in the united states what specifically did we hear from those 2 witnesses