michael beschloss with us as well. pete, what do you think it's like for the current white house in-house photographer team, their access and ability to move around, and what can you tell us about the folks who are going to be documenting the biden presidency at least early on? >> yeah, i don't have any inside information about the current white house photographer and her access. there's been very few behind the scenes pictures posted on the white house flickr photo stream. that is all i know, what everybody else knows. in terms of the incoming team, adam schultz will be biden's photographer. i spoke to biden, and most of which of which will remember the primary mission of your job, you be documenting the president for history. everything else, that is what matters most. you are the guy in the room when everything's going down, just make sure you capture all the great moments. >> michael beschloss, i'm concerned a bit of history is not going to get its due tomorrow. talk about the list of firsts and what it will mean w

michael beschloss stays with us. i'll turn to other experts from "the new york times" michelle goldberg and rnc chairman and michael steele who endorlsed joe biden. twitter suspending donald trump permanently. this is a development that has major media and political ramifications, particularly with a politician who has rode tweets into the white house quite literally. michael steele, your reaction? >> thank you, hello. we've been talking in this space about this for awhile now, okay, better late than never. a lot of damage done. understood. be prepared for the noise of the anti tech stuff and how big tech is undermining the president and the other side of the coin we need to be vigilant about. there are other sites down that are being created informing like parlor and others where this will continue to go on and fester. so it is important that we be prepared and recognize not just what's in front of us in terms of twitter, facebook, instagram and the other big name institutions. what's on the side and behind us. that

. >>> a presidential historian michael beschloss says he's never seen a president lie so continuously and outrageously as president trump. which lies are worst of the worst? that's next. >>> as the president makes new false statements days before the georgia senate runoff, calling them illegal and invalid a new piece on nbcnews.com looks at trump's many falsehoods and debunks them. taking a look, nbc reporter, good to see you. looking ahead to the georgia senate runoff election, first of all, how do we expect the president to react to the results? >> i think either way we're going to hear him say the system is broken. there's voter fraud. he lost that state. it's going to be really hard for him, even if republicans come out with a big win and secures them the senate, i don't think you'll see him say, oh, well, all is okay. he'll stick with a falsehood. one of the most consistent falsehoods the idea voter fraud plagues the american election. the popular vote is where voter fraud cost me that race and said it before the 2020 election and after the 2020 election. i don't think 2021 will

reverend sharpton, michael beschloss, thank you both. it is not just social media platforms silencing president trump. a number of major corporations are also cutting ties with him and his organization following last week's attack on the capitol by the president's supporters. we'll have the very latest on that growing list after the break. you're watching msnbc. e break. you're watching msnbc. did it co? you know i'm not sure. who's peter samuel? daddy? yeah? who's peter? well sweetie, he's your great-great grandfather. does he look like me? yeah. yeah? yeah. turn questions you've always had into stories you can't wait to share; with ancestry. our flight is early tomorrow. and it's a long flight too. once we get there, we will need... buttercup! ♪ .. .. but the right pad can. only always ultra thins have rapiddry technology and, they absorb 40% faster. the gush happens fast. that's why always absorbs faster. hey you, yeah you. i opened a sofi money account and it was the first time that i realized i could be earning interest back on my

michael beschloss, let's talk about the president. the phone recordings, certainly in history, nixon unwinding in the final days and a number of officials taking actions like the defense secretary, james schlessinger, to make sure the president couldn't do anything untoward. now you have ten former defense secretaries in both parties coming out, in the op-ed led by dick cheney saying the military should not get involved. how concerned should we be about the president? >> we should be very concerned, andrea. why would those former defense secretaries come out with a statement like that if they were not worried that trump might try to abuse the military either to get us involved in an unnecessary war or to call in 101st airborne to try to help him stay in office and stay in the white house. what we heard on that tape is an impeachable offense. how many presidents were impeached or almost impeached for abuse of power? this is a president, we heard it on that tape for an hour, abusing his power by threatening the secretary of state of the

let's go to michael beschloss and reverend al sharpton. i will start with you on this, michael. this will be the sort of silence and quiet that we anticipate tomorrow with all of those tributes to the dead which we haven't been able to have that catharsis over the past year given all the people that died from covid and the quiet and flags rustling and all that. in a sense, do you think that might be more meaningful than a big crowd? >> i think it will be more meaningful because it takes account of the moment. if we tried to imitate a normal inauguration with a big crowd, pretending there was not a pandemic, if we tried to take chances with security, pretending there was not a domestic terrorist attack on the capitol and congress on the 6th of january, that would be counter. if we're having a ceremony of unity, reconciliation, which i am sure tomorrow will be, you have to have one that's a little bit in tune with the moment. we americans just as our friend valerie was just saying, we have been through four years of a daily, hourly assault on our democracy, a president who hates d

michael steele, michael beschloss, a thanks to both of you on this inauguration eve. >> thanks. >>> right now here in washington, d.c., and across the country, families are hurting, businesses are hurting, how this pandemic has made this inauguration unlike any other. we also want to show you live pictures from inside the capitol once again because just a few moments ago, left side of your screen, of course, president-elect joe biden's treasury secretary nominee janet yellen, miss yellen was talking about the economic relief she thinks makes the most sense in this pandemic. she said that she thinks it's better to spend right now to spend right now, to get out of the pandemic. she also went on to say economic relief will lead to lowering the debt in the long run as the economy grows. janet yellen saying that just a few moments ago. apparently in between when her shot would freeze there during her virtual confirmation hearing. we'll be right back. this is msnbc. 'll be right back. this is msnbc. >>> this morning our country hit an unthinkable new milestone in this pandemic. here's the lates

joining me is michael beschloss. we understand that mccarthy, according to axios in that conversation with the president last night, was basically saying, no, mr. president, you're wrong, it was your people, not antifa. and kasie hunt is reporting that mccarthy was telling the president that this impeachment thing, it's apparently happening, or at least was trying to tell his own supporters not to vote for it but now they're letting them vote for it, if they want to. >> andrea, this is one of the nightmares of all times, we've got an irrational president who's desperately trying to hold on to power. he's facing enormous legal and financial problems, if he leaves the presidency. even if it's irrational, he's going to try to do almost anything he can to hold onto the presidency even though we rational people know it's impossible. i think we have to look at the next 13 days as sort of a domestic cuban missile crisis where we have to move our country safely through this period. we've got two things, i think, mainly to wo

michael beschloss continues being of counsel to us and watching with us. michael, this is the continuity of government we were talking about -- excuse me -- we were talking about earlier. this seeing our former presidents, reminds us who we are. >> it really does. and that's something we really have missed for four years. you know, some, brian, might just dismiss this as symbolism and certainly it is symbolic, but the fact that we have not seen scenes like this this for think, has given a lot of people the sense that you have had a flashing red light and an sos going on and off for our democracy during so much of donald trump's presidency. >> president and mrs. obama. >> can i just remark how flawless michelle obama is? i'm sorry. i don't mean to be obsessive. >> go, joy, go. >> you sure can. >> absolutely flawless. her fashion sense is uncanny, brilliant. she dresses her man up very well as well. i believe she consults to make sure he looks appropriate. >> can i tell you that michelle obama is so well dressed, she's the only person whose mask doesn't stan

this must never happen again. >> michael good to see you as always. thank you. michael beschloss. presidential historian mts stay well. >> thank you. author of "presidents of war c the pepic story from 1807 to modern times." a remarkable book and more relevant in times like this. >>> washington, d.c. we discussed looking more like a secured military zone. security very tight here with more threats of violence ahead of went's inauguration. this special edition of "velshi" is right back after this. . history says: fine jewelry for occasions. we say: forget occasions. (snap) fine jewelry for every day, minus the traditional markups. ♪♪ >>> we're live now from the nation's capital this morning. washington, d.c. with inauguration day on wednesday. this city has only four more days to prepare for this event. security's remaining top of mind for all law enforcement after the siege we saw at the capitol on january 6th where hundreds of lawmakers and the vice president were put in harm's way. thousands of national guardsmen sent here this past week as reinforcements with the defense de

general barry mccaffrey, michael beschloss, our thanks for joining us and laying it out for us. coming up for us, how easy is it to become radicalized? well, a "new york times" reporter is here to tell us about his former colleague who was spotted storming the capitol last week. these folks don't have time to go to the post office they use stamps.com all the services of the post office only cheaper get a 4-week trial plus postage and a digital scale the hectic. the tender. the tense. and the fiery. but for many, migraine keeps them... ...from saying... ..."i am here." we aim to change that... ...with... ...aimovig, a preventive treatment... ... for migraine in adults. one dose... ...once a month... ...is proven to reduce monthly migraine days. for some, by half or more. don't take aimovig if you're allergic to it. allergic reactions like rash or swelling can happen hours to days after use. severe constipation can happen. sometimes with serious complications. high blood pressure can happen or worsen with aimovig. common side effects include injection site reactions and constipati

michael beschloss, as pleasure. thank you. >> thank you. >>> ahead, how state capitols are responding to the warnings of armed protests ahead of the inauguration. you're watching msnbc. the inauguration you're watching msnbc. smooth driving pays off you never been in better hands allstate click or call for a quote today go pro at subway® for double the protein on any footlong. or on any new protein bowl! so many ways to go pro at subway®! it's not amateur-tein, it's pro-tein, baby! go pro and get double the protein for just $2 more. subway. eat fresh. a must in your medicine cabinet! less sick days! cold coming on? zicam® is clinically proven to shorten colds! highly recommend it! zifans love zicam's unique zinc formula. it shortens colds! zicam zinc that cold! sofi made it so easy to pay off my student loan debt. they were able to give me a personal loan so i could pay off all of my credit cards. i got my mortgage through sofi and the whole process was so easy. ♪ express yourself ♪ ♪ ♪ express yourself â

beschloss. chuck, first to you, president biden had a clear message of unity, but how does he make it a reality? >> he'll never stop trying one thing joe biden made clear the second he announced his decision to run is he always believed this was the most important thing he had to do, figure out how to bring the country together and repair the country from the last four years of divisiveness. there's not a question in my mind joe biden is going to constantly do this the question i have is, will republicans meet him even a quarter of the way they didn't for barack obama. will they do it for him? >> let me talk about vice president harris for a moment she's already hitting the ground running, isn't she >> she's been up in the senate, it's a 50/50 senate, so she can be the tiebreaker, but what she really wants do is build a consensus, get his legislation through. she's been calling mayors to work on the economic relief package, and also, of course, working on the racial injustice, democracy, some of

i'm joined by presidential historian michael beschloss. it's great to have you on the program. let me start with a quote from "the washington post." rahm emanuel said -- lincoln had the civil wart, kennedy had the height of the cold war, and johnson had unprecedented civil social strife. emanuel said biden has all of the above. >> i think that's true. i mean, i think joe biden has got problems that are of the level of lincoln and fdr and john kennedy, to some extent, in 1961, because he's got the pandemic, the number of people starving, this terrible economy right now, racial injustice that's been for four centuries and has come as to a head once again this past year. climate change, and also our democracy almost collapsed two weeks ago with an attack on the congress that was sponsored by the former president of the united states. >> there's no doubt anyone who has been following the news over the past 48 hours know there's a marked difference in the tone since biden came into office. just the way he's been speaking about respecting your colleagues, there was something so diffe

and joining me now, president 1458 historian michael beschloss. people are making the argument that what he did, what donald trump did, in-sur rektsing -- or inciting that mob towards insurrection wasn't really that. but now you have all of this context. and as an historian, i'm curious as to your take on it. we have the calls to the georgia state officials, visits to the white house, attempts in pennsylvania. and now reporting about an actual official at the department of justice who was prepared to lead this effort to have the justice department lead the overturning of the election. all of this taken together may or may not be relevant to the senators who are voting on impeachment, but they are relevant to history and what donald trump has been up to. >> i agree. jefferson davis incited an insurrection against the united states and it caused a civil war. after the civil war was over, did we treat jefferson davis as some honored citizen of the united states? no. he was in disgrace and he was punished. that is going to happen to donald trump if th

beschloss. chuck, where do you see the republican party going from here, especially after some voted to impeach >> well, look. it is at a real crossroads this is a very divided party, particularly the leadership of the party is in one place. they would like to get rid of the virus that is donald trump whether that's mitch mcconnell, liz cheney, even some people who, while they didn't vote for impeachment, are hoping that the result is that he is somehow ex-communicated from the party and impeachment isn't a bad way to do it but here's the rub, lester the problem is while the leadership is in one place, the grassroots of the party is still a trump party. >> all right michael, this is a historic second impeachment of a president. how will history books describe this moment? >> they will say that donald trump owns two, one half of all the presidential impeachments in history. they will say that today was the most bipartisan impeachment in modern history, and also, this guy can get convicted that's

joining me white house reporter for associated press jonathan lazeer and historian michael beschloss. the president is making sure if he leaves aboard air force one, this will be a presidential exit unlike any other. what are you hearing about? >> first, andrea, the president has largely been out of sight for weeks now and in a period of hibernation more or less since the election, which he continues to contest privately. even though last week he finally acknowledged publicly a new administration would be taking power. he, of course, has largely advocated his day job. the coronavirus is surging throughout this nation and the white house has done very little to stop it. he hasn't been out there taking the vaccine or outside of a few taped videos done much of anything to tamp down the tension that filled this nation in particular here in the nation's capitol. the white house has already called a lid today, so we will not be seeing the president. and he will also deliver no commemoration to zr martin luther king jr. on the holiday that bears his name. we don't know what we will see tomor

and who better than nbc presidential historian michael beschloss. michael, you could argue this is a ceremonial event in the past, with the southern writer in mind, perhaps signifying sound and fury, rather, full of sound and fury and signifying nothing. but today republicans are trying to turn it into something very different. is there any precedent for this? >> no, nothing like this at all, andrea. you and i have talked about this, and chuck too, and katy. this is a situation where we have no contested election. we had one in 1800. we had one in 1824, 1876, 2000 there were serious questions over who had won the presidency. no person in his right mind thinks that donald trump was elected president in november of last year. and instead, you've got a president who is trying to hijack the process, in some way turn this to his own advantage, to overturn the election. he's now tweeting, praising things this morning like voters are demanding that the election be redone, or the legislatures have not approved of this election. those things are lies. we've

michael beschloss now is the texas news presidential historian. michael, i -- we had planned to have you on to talk about how the new government will function, how the system will work and now we're at a place unprecedented. if we sure are you and i never thought we'd see a night like this, shep. in a situation where, you know, the definition of terrorism is the use of violence especially against civilians to achieve a political aim. that was a terrorist attack on our congress today and our u.s. capitol and this is not a partisan comment that was incited by the president, president trump who add midday gave that speech to that mob saying, march up pennsylvania avenue to the capitol, take back our country, stop the stealing of this election and then after they occupied the capitol and there's one woman killed so far and other violence used up there, he went into the rose garden and made a video saying to the mob that was up in the capitol, we love you, we think you're very special. that's something that no president in american history would ever h

i want to thank the members of our committee, martha, mike, ann, and our historian adviser michael beschloss, for their year long/du#â–  commitment and numerable contributions to the planning of this summit. with the terrific staff of the white house historical association and stewart mclawrence's vision and leadership we've convened more than 100 presidential sites as well as leading experts in the wide array of fields and interests that the presidential site representatives told us that they wanted to hear from. i want to thank our good friend david rubenstein for moderating a fascinating conversation with the descendants about their personal first hand experiences of living in the white house or sharing family stories that have been passed down to them through the ages. that is what it is really like to be in the white house. in our next panel, we will shift gears to hollywood, and as dede myers said in her message, we'll examine how both the big and small screen portray the fictional perspective of the white house and the people who live there and who work there. from comedies to dramas,

. >> and michael beschloss, we have so many examples of that, i mean george h.w. bush brokenhearted when he lost and confounded you this guy, how bill clinton of all people, that most of his supporters didn't think was worthy of being an american president, how he wrote that note, showed great dignity, he stayed out of bill clinton's way, and in the process actually became a father figure to president clinton. >> whoever would have imagined? and you're absolutely right, joe, you know, the morning of the inauguration of 1993 barbara and george bush and their dog are standing on the front step. clintons get out of the car and george bush shakes hands with chelsea and says welcome to your new home. that's the way it's supposed to be. and the other thing, joe, is that as you and willie and mika and nancy all know, ex-presidents are really expensive. we pay a lot of money for their staff, we pay for expenses of their offices. we pay for a lot of things. in donald trump's case, do we all want to pay for someone who may still be plotting against our government, who may b

incidentally, michael beschloss, the ppds winning historian who edited transscripts of the johnson white house tape and turned it into a book called "taking charge." beschloss cuts off that conversation right after like i'm riding a wire fence. he said look, i'm a pulitzer prize winning historian, the word bung hole is not appearing in my book. anyway, you've got this unattractive basically insecure guy who doesn't feel comfortable with foreign policy, who has inherited the kennedy team of best and brightest advisers and who believes in a he needs some gesture in the realm of northern policy to prove, number one, that he's not soft on communism, number two, that he's not a mad bomber like barry goldwater, and number three, that he can act in a mature presidential fashion when dealing with a foreign policy crisis and also, this is very important, he wants a gesture that doesn't appear as though it will siphon off a large deal of money from the great society programs he's in the process of constructing. he got his opportunity with what became to be known as the tonkin gulf incidents of aug

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and in the interim, we are overjoyed to be able to talk to the historian and author michael beschloss, who has been -- it's hard to put this. his twitter feed is a work of art of social and historian activism these days. michael, i've been thinking about you a lot, because of what we're witnessing today. there's an obvious call back to what happened at the capitol building in the war of 1812, but can you believe we witnessed an event today that has us reaching back to the war of 1812? >> no, and thank you, my friend, for your kind word. did you or i ever think that we would be living through a day like this or a night like this? here we've got just as you were saying earlier, a terrorist event, just as there was in the middle of the 1812 war, or near the end of the 1812 war, august of 1814, when the british burned the white house and the capitol, or, the attack on ft. sumter, 1861, or 9/11, which we all remember. but the difference between those things and what we saw today is this, a terrorist attack on the congress and the capitol, was initiated by the president of the united states

michael beschloss is fond of saying democracy survived a close call. do you agree? >> oh, absolutely. if donald trump had been reelected, who knows where we would be, look at his behavior post losing the election, and what did he lose by? it would be different. it was a close call. we're not out of the woods by any means. a large chunk of one party is not willing to repudiate what was done, what happened, what was done in their name, and what they enabled and helped to do, which is a serious threat to overturn the most fundamental aspects of our democracy. so there'll be challenges ahead. the culture, society, our politics are all somewhat broken, made much worse by the four years of trump. they were pre-existing problems, obviously, and so there's an awful lot of work to be done. i totally agree for president biden, he's been excellent in tone. a large part of the country has pulled together and they will continue to pull together. people, it's a time to rise to the occasion and it will remain a time to ask all of us, actually, to rise to the occasion. in all my di

. >> tom, i had michael beschloss, general barry mccaffrey on during one segment last night, the consensus of those two gentlemen was move the inauguration indoors, what are you waiting for? do you agree? >> well, i'm not going to contradict the secret service or the fbi, and i would leave it to them to be their call. as an american, i bristle at that instinctively because we shouldn't have to move one of the most important rituals of our democracy indoors because of our own citizens. if we get to that point, if we get to the point where we can't even observe the basic constitutional rituals of american democracy because we have turned into a society of armed insurrectionists, then we're in a lot -- we're in a lot more trouble than we ever thought we could be by 2021. with that said, i am not on the inside of that process, and if it were -- if i were advising anybody, i would say the secret service and the fbi are the experts. if they tell you to move it inside. but i think that would be an immense tragedy. >> tom, thought of you today because there's reporting in politico about radicaliza

i'm told michael beschloss is still part of our coverage and michael, looking at that extraordinary shot, and it is a rare view of the white house from the washington monument, the eye focuses on the rose garden which has been a subject you have talked a lot about, especially on social media. once and for all, what did the now-departed first lady do to the rose garden? how would it physically to those of us who are casual viewers or visitors, how would it look different than, perhaps, this time a year ago? >> well, for everyone, i was just thinking about that myself, brian. i'm looking at the white house rose garden on our screen. it's just to the sort of middle left near the area where you see some people walking right now. in 1962 jacqueline kennedy got her friend to advise her on how to turn the white house rose garden into something lush that looked like something that you might find in a place in virginia or maryland and there were crab apple trees and there were beautiful flowers. and it was lush. you couldn't see the colenade we see now with six pillars that have a look of eastern

you have a great quote from presidential historian michael beschloss, who says, when a president breaks that bond of trust with the american people, it makes it harder for future presidents to have the kind of moral authority that enables them to protect us. what does all of this mean for biden and harris? >> michael and i talked about this a lot. and i was asking him, you know, what do you think? of course, biden is a known commodity, he's been around a lot longer in politics than president trump, so of course the president-elect will have an asset that people do know him. but he said, you know, the moments you really need that trust is when you're going to war, when you're dealing with a pandemic, when a president needs to stand up, tell you the truth, and tell you what you need to do about it as a country, either in supporting a war effort or standing 6 feet away from everybody. so he said, that's the moment that it's really important. so that's when we're going to see what's going to happen with the biden/harris administration, but i think big picture, definitely made it harder for

nbc news presidential historian michael beschloss, helping us to understand this moment. truly, the only question to you is, how does this fit in, right? how do people look back on this? i was struck yesterday, the president issued a tweet that was taken down, right? twitter, he was muzzled, basically, on that platform, but he talked about how this might be a day remembered forever. yeah, but not for the reasons he thinks. >> right. it doesn't fit into history because we've never seen anything like it. we've seen other terrorist events, assault on the capitol, burning by the british, 1814. assault on ft. sumter, which started the sicivil war, 1961, 9/11, which most of us remember. but unlike all of those things, this one was instigated and incited by the president of the united states. we still don't know exactly why or who was involved. and the scary thing is, this is a guy who over the next two weeks is going to still have an enormous amount of power. he has talked from time to time throughout his presidency almost like a small boy. you wouldn't believe the kind of powe

before i let you go, i know you need to get some rest, what you were just talking about with michael beschloss, i wonder if you have thought through how republicans can begin with somebody on my team called earlier today de-baathification of the republican party? and i wonder if liz cheney, her statement being the thing that republicans used -- the democrats used, sorry, to explain why they needed to impeach donald trump, is there a little wing of the republican party that you think can do this sort of de-baathification of the party and can it work at this point? >> look, i think the challenges is that the rot is from the grassroots all the way to the presidency, to the rot is at every layer. you can call it rot because it's now criminal sedition. but there are people who supported it from the grassroots all the way up through to the white house. i think what liz cheney may be is part of a party that may not always be called republicans, or maybe that other part that's top to the bottom corrupted by trumpism isn't always called republicans, they can't coexist. what is clear to me tod

michael beschloss, historian who joins us only on important days and at important moments. we don't know what is going on inside the car but we assume it is a good reason this walk has been delayed a little bit. tell us what you are thinking, taking in, soaking in today. >> well you know, if you came from another planet and saw what was happening today, you would know that things had changed very much from previous inaugurations. here we have the new president getting out of the car near the white house. shall i keep on talking or would you like some quiet for a moment. >> woodruff: no, you keep on talking, you can describe what is going on and give us a little historical perspective at the same time. >> sure, the new president is getting out of his car which is now adays called "the beast." presidents have been using automobiles since thee door roosevelt-- theodore roosevelt in 19023 who took his firth ride in hartford, connecticut, and since then have become more and more armoured especially after the time of john f. kennedy assassination of 1963. but the scene that we ar

. >> michael beschloss is back with us. michael, we have a new president, donald trump now a former president. >> that's for sure, and i think we've got two book ends on the last four years. i think what president biden suggested, and i think this is going to be the view of history, is that for four years history was hijacked by donald trump, taken in a white supremacist democratic and joe biden wants something new. this is a president who is very aware of the fact that, as we were talking earlier, unlike franklin roosevelt facing a great depression or a lincoln facing the civil war, joe biden has got about five crises at once. he's got to deal with them all right now. and that's exactly what he was saying. but the three words in the speech will be known for are democracy has prevailed. so nice to have a happy ending. >> indeed it is. and indeed it has. and indeed lawrence o'donnell joins our coverage and has been watching. lawrence? >> brian, joe biden had to deliver the speech of his life, and he did. in my lifetime, i ha

the president has now linked him to this action where normally his role would be -- michael beschloss tonight compared to the bert parks. his role would be m. c. there's no heft to the role, no job to do. what does he do knowing he's been publicly threatened with political trouble going forward if he shows anything but steadfast loyalty to the boss? >> there's a story in "the times" he told trump i can't do anything about this. >> and he put out a statement refuting it. >> okay, that was maggie haberman who did that story. i would bet anybody a dollar that that story is accurate. maggie does not make mistakes. and they're going to go back to indiana high. that's what's going to happen. this whole thing is falling apart right in front of our eyes, and it's just fun to watch. it really is. i'm immensely enjoying watching this entire melt down. and these two people are going to do our country great in washington. and, you know, we're going to move ahead, and trump lost and pence knows it, and everybody knows it. and i seriously doubt maggie's story is wrong, seriously. >> james carville,

. >> also with us, staffer from new yorker and msnbc contributor and historian michael beschloss. it was striking to me how much the context of the day changed meaning of the words that joe biden gave. many things, talked about disunion, made mention of abraham lincoln, said uncivil war, there's lots of contexts in which people invoke lincoln, talk about the preservation of the union, but there's a specific force to that when you just walked through a door that two weeks ago people were banging down in violent attempt to stop the transfer of power. >> yeah, chris. after hearing that speech feel as if i've been through a shipwreck and staggering on to dry land, getting land legs again. that's the way that joe biden's speech made us feel. might have seen a president use before a metaphor like civil war or disunion, but not two weeks after an insurrection that could have destroyed congress, overturned an election and destroyed our democracy. we're living in the aftermath of that, almost as if we have a little bit of ptsd. that's why biden's speech worked so well. it was speech of uni

michael beschloss, we always go back. for me, over the past four years i will admit at times when it was hard to watch the news, in fact, mika would have to watch the news for me, for a year or two at a time i could not watch. i could only read the news because i was so agitated by what i saw. but reading history always provided me great comfort over these past four years because i saw whatever we were going through at times seemed small compared to what concerns we had faced in the past certainly during the civil war but also the skepticism that i heard everyday about the future of this country. leaders have had, americans have had -- well, as long as this country has existed, tom rick's extraordinary book "first principles" he taught me earlier this summer that as george washington was dying he was fearful that his entire life project was in vain, that this country was not going to survive. he did not like the direction it was going. thomas jefferson felt the same way. called the missouri compromise an act of suicide. a

general barry mccaffrey, michael beschloss, our thanks for joining us and laying it out for us. coming up, how easy is it to become radicalized? well, a "new york times" reporter is here to tell us about his former colleague who was spotted storming the capitol last week. st week.e commission fees and account minimums. so, you can start investing today, wherever you are - even on the bus. download now and get your first stock on us. robinhood. and ask your doctor about biktarvy. biktarvy is a complete, one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in certain adults. it's not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights h-i-v to help you get to and stay undetectable. that's when the amount of virus is so low it cannot be measured by a lab test. research shows people who take h-i-v treatment every day and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit h-i-v through sex. serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. rare, life-threatening side effects include a buildup of lactic acid and liver problems. do not take biktarvy if you take dofet