rumsfeld would do this, too. he would mock reporters who would ask are we going to get stuck like vietnam. any time someone brought up the word quagmire, he would make fun of people and put them down. the irony is that six months into the war rumsfeld writes one of these memos to his generals saying i'm really worried that we aren't going to be able to get our troops out of afghanistan unless we come up with a plan to stabilize the country. he ended the memo with one word. it said "help!" here in public, dismissing any comparison to vietnam, but in private, that's exactly what they're worried about. fast forward 20 years, that's what happened with the biden administration. joe biden was asked, i think it was just in july, when u.s. troops had all but withdrawn from afghanistan, he was asked could there be a saigon moment in afghanistan, meaning you'd have an evacuation off the roof of the u.s. embassy and helicopters? biden was very zis miss sive of this. no way, that's ne not going to happen. that's not what's g

as rumsfeld said who are the bad guys? this is a simplistic view of the american set in afghanistan. there were good guys and bad guys. that's how we look at it but the problem was a lot of the good guys, americans like to think of ourselves at good guys but our allies in the afghan government, these warlords, corrupt government officials, they were not always so good and the population didn't like them very much. the bad guys was just shorthand for anyone who is shooting at us. yet we could always define their motivations. this was a problem that united states never figured out. fast-forward about 15 15 yean rumsfeld wrote that memo, the war commander and i think 2017 general john campbell was testifying before congress and he was asked by senators if the taliban is in the? are we fighting the taliban? general campbell kind of stammered and paused and didn't want to answer the question and finally he said no. our countries idea, the taliban is not the enemy. we are trying to reconcile with them politically. even in recent

it became known as the rumsfeld case, which was filed in germany. it was accompanied by a case filed in france that was succeeded by a case filed in switzerland, which cap george bush -- which kept george bush and company from traveling to switzerland under fear of arrest. it was how we should be thinking abou war when the u.s. insists upon waging it and the u.s. citizenry insists upon backing it. what is notable from the hearings we have been hearing on the afghanistan withdrawal, particular with respect, everyone in congress seems to be really, really deeply concerned about the question of failure, and no one seems to be concerned about the question of killing and lawlessness. had we had this level of congressional interest, congressional concern at the beginning back in the days after 9/11, when congress gave the president the green light to do whatever he wanted and advocated its role under the war powers, advocated its role to be a check on the president in terms of waging war, if we had this level of engagement and attention at that point, we

but even though he objected to it, and he told bush and rumsfeld and cheney, vice president cheney, you have got to allow diplomacy to work. he was constantly pushing for diplomacy, yet when it came time for him to be pushed into it, he stepped into the ranks and he did go forth and give the briefing. later, he actually said "people will never trust me again,." delano: during that speech, he spoke about weapons of destruction in iraq, and given that that speech shaped u.s. foreign policy for two decades or so, how damaging was it to his career? >> the speech did not so much damage his career as secretary of state, and i will get to that in a minute, but it did, once we got into iraq. first off, let me say this -- we had no legal reason to go into iraq. saddam was not a good person. i dealt with him later when i was operations chief for task force 134, detention operations. said dam was not a good person. but he did maintain a fine balance of power between iraq and iran, and as long as he stayed in power, then we were going to have stability in the middle east. that invasion ended up cau

you know, you know, i'm referring to the deceased or criminal donald rumsfeld and with the same it's become a slightly more emotional because of the skin color. but what he did was hoping to basically serve the empire to elias ministry wage was and in the k. so for co little pound, of course, he has a pre history to iraq, which is very mom. he was one of the younger officers who come right up, the main line massacre which made her became a huge scandal in the u. s. history. so that's what he is a celebrate pharaoh and give them a going to send off because they support all this stuff and have been for ages. now the media and the global media in the west is a central player and all the wars that have been taking place in the 21st century the lies about iraq were told by the new york tribes. what federal in the b, b. c. under pressure from blair, director general the bbc or didn't tow the line will basically forced out, etc, etc. so these walls have effectively cemented guerrero of the state media in particular like the bbc of cnn and our western terminals. tony tony blinkin biden's, a

i have to go if rumsfeld is going to go. ainsley: according to information online he was born in new york city, in 1937. he was raised in the bronx, and his parents actually immigrated here from jamaica. he went to public schools he graduated from the city college of new york, earned a bachelor's degree in geology and then he participated in the rotc program which led to becoming a four star general. he was awarded so many different awards, defense distinguished service medal four times, navy distinguished service medal, the air force distinguished service medal, the coast guard, the same award, the defense superior service medal and list goes on and on. will: first african american secretary of state. brian: they list in terms of somebody who designed the operation desert storm, he oversaw 28 crisis including the invasion of panama in 1989 he formulated the powell doctrine, which limits american military action unless it satisfies criteria regarding national security interest and the persian gulf war, we pushed them back an

well, i mean, it's what usually happens or similar, not as a few service rumsfeld because he was just a white guy doing his job. you know, you know, i'm referring to the deceased war criminal, donald rumsfeld and with the same it's become a slightly more emotional because of a skin color. but what he did was will fail to basically serve the empire to elias ministry wage was. and in the case of a, he was one of the younger officers who come up the main line massacre, which later became a huge scoundrel in the u. s. history. so that's what he is a barrow and give them a going to send off because they support all this stuff and have been for ages. now the media, the global media in the west is a central player in all the wars that have been taking place in the 21st century. the lies about iraq were told by the new york times were better in the b, b. c. under pressure from blair, director general the bbc or didn't tow the line were basically forced out, etc, etc. so these walls have affected me, cemented the role of the state media in particular like the bbc of cnn and other western termi

and rumsfeld, sorry secretary of defense rumsfeld and powell disagreed. they disagreed because powell believed in using overwhelming force and doing it sparingly. don't do it all of the time. powell is the one who pushed something called the powell doctrine which limited the number of times the united states should use multi force for diplomatic reasons. he thought one of the lessons of vietnam was you don't send boys into war unless the country is behind it and the mission is clear and if you send them in to war you send them in to win. so he tried to zis courage the use of military force. he restored honor. one of his jobs was to clean out the mess after iran contra. he was the national security adviser and given the responsibility to look at covert action and figure out if all of it was legal and anything that wasn't legal to get rid of it. he was devoted to service and brought to the mission a philosophy that i think most americans if they thought about it would embrace. don't use the military unless you have to and keep casualties low and increasing

he was not part of this group noticed the vulcans who were basically rumsfeld cheney condi rice. ah, paul wolf, a wits. and so power came began as an outlier. and his role was very different than it had been when he was a general. he was the diplomat. ah, he was not in the pentagon. he was not making military strategy. so as the bush administration started to in the summer of 2002 started to make its plan for invading iraq. he went to bush and he said, look, you know, i've looked at the plan for this. i don't think it's right. i don't think you have enough troops and i don't think you should do it unless you have support, not only the american public, but from our allies, excuse me, to do it. and so he, he did persuade bush to take it to the united nations, to the security council and tried to get, try to get support where, where cow was not very successful. the bridge certainly were on board but, but not many others were none of the none of the big players in the european in the european alliance except for britain at that point. and so they, they were worried they. busy they wa

as sec serbs we'll get to this in a moment it was the rumsfeld doctrine which was a smaller force, try to get in and out as quickly as possible and secretary of state powell helped sell the iraq war but did not agree with the rumsfeld approach. >> certainly didn't. during the first gulf war, i was there at the pentagon covering the first gulf war. his strategy was not only you have to have a decisive overwhelming force. you have to have a plan to win but then you have to have a quick exit strategy to get out, and a lot of people forgot that to liberate kuwait after saddam hussein invaded kuwait and then you had months of operation desert shield which eventually became operation desert storm january 1991 you had to have an exit strategy to get out as quickly as possible. within six weeks, the air warnings the ground war, it was over. the u.s. and its allies, 540,000 troops, six aircraft carrier battle groups in the persian gulf, did it and got out. now, during the iraq war in 2003, i think under 200,000 troops were deployed. a lot fire, and there was really no overwhelming capability to

cheney and rumsfeld had worked together directly, so getting on the wrong side of them. and he was for profound reasons. he thought the iraq war was a mistake from the beginning and told the president that. >> well, he was a singular figure in american life for sure. andrea mitchell, thank you so much for being here. >>> tomorrow could be the last dance for voting rights legislation on capitol hill. the senate will hold a test vote on the freedom to vote act. it's all but certain to fail because it's unlikely to pick up the 60 votes it needs to get rid of the filibuster. chuck schumer said he would talk to his colleagues if that's what it takes. >> we know this runs deep. if our republican colleagues have good idea, we'll work with them. we'll listen to them. if these ideas are truly aligned with the goal to protect our democracy, we'll work to include them in the final text. >> the freedom to vote act sets minimum standards for voting, including automatic registration, two weeks of early voting and making election day a holiday. it also seeks to protect elections from u

i see rumsfeld up there on screen and even dealing with people like us secretary rumsfeld, i never heard a bad word out of colin powell about him yet. you know, his attitude, if something came across the deck that was difficult to deal with room looked like it might come from a place that would invite a criticism. his attitude was done is just having a bad day. what can we do for and that was the way he lived life. you know, one time he was very humble. you know, one time when we were in maprid and i traveled around the world with him. i i sort of played hooky from one of the events we were supposed to be at raising money for raqqa night. i wanted to give my kids a few things from the prado museum. well, lo and behold, the invites me to be in his car as we drive back to the airport so i've got this bag, you know, and it's full of things for my kids. it and i told him and he just he just laughed taste good. you know what family matters too. and i think it's it's really great to hear you talk about him from your perspective because we obviously see him from. >> such a distance away. on the

i was reading a reuters obituary, describes him as getting out maneuvered by cheney and rumsfeld, and i think over time that's not right. i think that his contributions to our politics are as seismic as his contributions to our country and our military and our government. i was on the mccain campaign when he announced his support for then senator obama. it was a political earthquake, the likes of which i cannot think of anything that rivals it. and when he came out and sort of laid his decades of military experience, his -- as we've all been discussing -- complicated legacy in the bush years, when he laid all that on the line and endorsed president obama, it was as big of a seismic sort of shift inside our country's politics as anything i'd ever witnessed. and having been on the campaign of the other guy, i don't know that there were many blows that rivalled that. and for him to have spent -- i mean, he went on to endorse hillary clinton in 2016. he was a vocal critic of the danger donald trump represented. he endorsed president biden. i mean, he was just a force on every field in whi

though the president had used the same information, congress had used the same information, secretary rumsfeld, condoleezza rice, all of us were using the same information but i made the biggest presentation. it also fell on me. that is show business. david: today in hindsight would you say the invasion was a mistake? gen powell: i would see the execution of the invasion was not done properly. we abandoned the army without any discussion in washington and then we abandoned something worse, the baath party, and said anyone who worked for the baath party could not work in government. those were bad strategic decisions and we did not have enough force to do what we wanted the iraq army to do in the place fell apart. right now, iraq has democracy. it is tricky but they have elections and are trying to restore order in their country. if they do all of that, i think it is bad we went about it in such a terrible way in my humble judgment. if they come out through this difficult process as a democracy, no weapons of mass destruction, no saddam hussein, i think you have to judge this differently than h

though the president had used the same information, congress had used the same information, secretary rumsfeld, condoleezza rice, all of us were using the same information, but i'm the one who made the biggest presentation of it, so it all sort of fell on me. that's show business, huh? david: today in hindsight, would you say the invasion was a mistake? colin: i would say the execution of the invasion was not done properly. we abandoned the army without any discussion back in washington, and then we abandoned something worse, the baath party, and said anybody who worked for the baath party could not work in the new government. those were two monstrously bad strategic decisions, and we did not have enough force in there to do what we wanted the iraq army to do, and the place fell apart. now, right now, iraq has a democracy. it is tricky, but it is a democracy. they have elections, and they are trying to restore order in their country. if they do all that, i think it is bad that we went about it in such a terrible way, in my humble judgment -- others will not agree with me -- that if they come o

but rumsfeld status doesn't mean the lake driving direct impact such as draining it for irrigation and hunting dog. indirect threats remain grounds water extraction 3 need by wealth is reducing the lake water level and animal grades read bad. in september 2018. the lake dry dock, completely religious black, dry mud during the season. when it is the most important for birds, there was no water and no birds. the chant say it's a ramps on site and declare victory and walk away. i mean, constantly, she is a never ending battle, like as long as that place is there, you have to make sure it stays there. john is working on a number of fronts, the safe, the lake, and had just signed an agreement, protected with a provincial governor. meanwhile, he struggled to prevent the damn from being built on the iris river wetlands continued just coming here regularly, year after year. reminds me the importance of the work we're doing. and even if i lose, i'll have it on my conscience. all know, i have done my best and i did it just turn my back in diva. it had estimated this around half the world's wetla

alongside sadam. hussein against romania, he was their friend. cheney was a friend of saddam hussein, rumsfeld youth defense sick transit time iraq was the destroyed was a close friend of saddam hussein. ultimately they sold amounts and hanged him. you are friends of america. let's say that we'll not view one of these days. a murder, they hang us off. back then they were laughing, but he was right. cut off. his words proved to be eerily true. because 3 years later, the west would kill him and destroy his country. nothing could be more emblematic of how dirty and evil this whole situation is than hillary clinton, literally jumping for joy upon hearing of cut off his demise after he was brought silly sodomite, lynched and executed by nieto backed rebels. we came, we saw her died. people don't like to hear this when you say that libya was doing better under qaddafi because it's incompatible with all the propaganda they've been fed. but this is the truth could off his biggest sin is that he dared to nationalize his own country's resources and threatened us monetary had gemini and the international

and then secretary defense rumsfeld, you know, we're, we're doing so much more publicly. and i think this is, you know, this is, you know, the kind of, the, the mist asked licks to aspect of colon polls experience. he was a strong believer in institutions both in terms of military institutions and later, you know, you know, i could see in serving up the state department, how he had literally begun to bring, you know, the institution, the state department in the 21st century. you know, those are to his credit, but he was, as we have talked about, you know, very uncomfortable or certainly relative to some of his, his colleagues of, of being, you know, fully engaged publicly in, in difficult political matters. and, and, you know, that's, that's part of his record. one final quick thought and it goes back to actually the, the tweet which i read out from secretary defense, lloyd austin a moment ago where he said he was a tremendous personal friend and a mentor to me. and that's important, isn't it? the mentorship side of things, i guess colon powell showed for young black amer

rumsfeld, mr. wolfowitz, mr. fife, gave jerry bremer the necessary guidance and instructions to disband the army if that's what he thought was right. and jerry issueds the order, -- issued the order, disbanding the army. i didn't know it was going to happen. i know senior members of the joint chiefs of staff didn't know it. cia didn't know it. the suddenly the army is totally disbanded, and you have these hundreds of thousands of people who are armed and trained in the use of arms who are set free. and within a few weeks, they're lining up wanting their pensions, and we had to pay some of them in order to keep some peace. and then we started to rebuild an iraqi army, and it's taken some time. so i think it was a bad decision. if jerry bremer was here, he would tell you it was the right decision. but i think it was the wrong decision. and most importantly, it was not what we told the president we were going to do. host: given that the u.s. is now out of iraq, at least in terms of being a combat force, what ultimat

we didn't hear an apology from, from busher, from rumsfeld or from dick cheney. but he was able to reflect upon it and say that this was a mistake. and i think that is something that's admirable and that we don't really have from politicians to day lawrence cope in washington. busy d c, why did he run for president? it seems like he could have done that or possibly on multiple occasions and might have been pretty close to it. actually he was thinking of running in 1996. ah. and his wife almost talked him out of a, she was afraid for his life that yes, the 1st african american you know, to, to get the nomination. he, you know, he, some people might come after him. and i remember, you know, reading about that it as book and talking to him about i think he would have been a great president. i think it wouldn't wonder if they had run and $96.00 or 2000. but that's my understanding. and that says a lot about this country that you know, a man or person of such great stature, intellect and bravery, is of, you know, it doesn't want to run because of what happens to be hi

rumsfeld, mr. wolfowitz, mr. fife, gave jerry bremer the necessary guidance and instructions to disband the army if that's what he thought was right. and jerry issueds the order, -- issued the order, disbanding the army. i didn't know it was going to happen. i know senior members of the joint chiefs of staff didn't know it. cia didn't know it. the suddenly the army is totally disbanded, and you have these hundreds of thousands of people who are armed and trained in the use of arms who are set free. and within a few weeks, they're lining up wanting their pensions, and we had to pay some of them in order to keep some peace. and then we started to rebuild an iraqi army, and it's taken some time. so i think it was a bad decision. if jerry bremer was here, he would tell you it was the right decision. but i think it was the wrong decision. and most importantly, it was not what we told the president we were going to do. host: given that the u.s. is now out of iraq, at least in terms of being a combat force, what ultimat

. >> yes, as donald rumsfeld said, weakness is provocative. the fall of afghanistan, we enforced in their minds the notion that the u.s. first of all is just feeble. but also incompetent. leave morgue than what -- 83 billion dollars worth of equipment and 400 americans maybe more. leaving our afghan allies there. leaving and not doing very much about our british and other nato allies. china looks at that, says that, well, the united states is finished. >> gordon chang we have frozen our defense budget. and communist china are goingful bore ahead with nuclear missiles and conventional weaponry. with a navy, with submarines. and pushing on all fronts looks like xi is doing a imitation of mao. and opposing his will on every day life, the people there, this is a very, very risky period for the reasons you said we have a president in my view, incapable of being command every in chief and u.s. know that. >> thank you, mark. mark: we'll be right back. age is just a number. and mine's unlisted. try boost® high protein with 20 grams of protein for mus

house fellows in the nixon administration who later served as special assistant to counselor donald rumsfeld. he's the chief editorial assistant to former president nixon on research and writing of his memoirs during the presidency years in san clemente. and he has the distinction of having seven interviewed the former president for 38 hours on tape in 1983 in those materials reside in the peabody archive. our distinguished speaker this evening is john roy price the road scholar and harvard educated attorney who migrated from 1968 rockefeller campaign to that of nixon. he promptly joined the new nixon administration in 199 working with daniel patrick moynihan and later working with domestic adviser john ehrlichman a special system to the president for urban affairs. he ultimately became head of government relations for chase manhattan bank and present ceo of the federal bank of pittsburgh. a special note jonas joined this evening by his daughter alexandria so welcome to both of you. john's new book "the last liberal republican" an insider's perspective on nixon's surprising social policy" re

he later developed a rivalry with donald rumsfeld during the w. bush years. talk to me about his leadership style and how it evolved and affected decades of u.s. military strategy. look, they say the sign of a great person is to be able to evolve and change over time and he certainly did that. >> yeah, i believe he did. in fact, he was very good as a staff officer certainly in the pentagon, but he also could lead. and he led large organizations such as the fifth core when i met him in germany in the 1980s. and then forces command, which is the largest army command that the army has. it's in charge of all army forces in the continental united states. he had that, a more directive type of leadership. and then as national security adviser for president reagan, that was more of a soft power because that was an adviser, coming up with plans and advising then president reagan. and then as secretary of state, a whole different kind of leadership is needed. one is certainly as an adviser to president bush on foreign policy but also being a representative throughout t

eight or nine months of the bush admistration, well lost fight after fight when dick cheney and donald rumsfeld and others who were called the neoconservatives were really running the administration. there was a good bet that powell was not going to last until the end of the year. but then september 11 happened, powell decided to stay, but he is still very isolated. they basically saw him as a milk carton. they put him in the refrigerator and when they needed him, they would bring him on the shelf. they brought him off the shelf in 2003 to talk at the u.n. because there was no one else in thedministration who could give the attention -- get the attention and respect and colin powell gave that talk which was from a to z false. he was the only one in the administration and a year and half later, he is gone. he is complicated because in many ways, he did not fit in with the republican party. he did not leave until earl this year. but he increasingly, anyone who is a moderate, black moderate, simply had no place in the republican party. he endorses obama. he endorses biden. he endorses hillary clin

i ended up staying with rumsfeld. he joined the army in 1958 before the march on washington before the civil rights movement. played a very important role in integrating one of our nations most cherished institution. the first african-american national security advise tore, secretary of state. the child of immigrants. parents came from jamaica. his mother was a steam stress. he went to city college of new york, a c student. he rose to such incredible prominence and lived such an incredible life. i think his life is a repudiation of the narrative that america is an irredeemably systemically racist country. he faced racism in his life and overcame it a and achieved so much. in ra systemically racist company his -- >> dana: he gave the graduation speech at howard university. never lose faith in america. its faults are yours to fix, not the curse. there may be differences and disputes within the family but we must not allow the family to be broken into warring factions. >> 100%. he was a patriot who loved this country and

. >> it sounds almost rumsfeld in. we do know the reason why we don't know which is a very good way of looking at it. the last telephone call that trump had as you report with xi jinping was at spicy unprintable one that was followed by his spicy unprintable comment in march, late march of 2020, followed then by an extraordinary sort of propaganda counter propaganda campaign between the trump administration xi jinping's people, the wolf warrior sang actually this is a virus that might have come from the united states. and it is fake news that came from wuhan. then the trump administration, mike pompeo and others branding it china flu, the china virus, and implying very heavily that this was perhaps even a biological weapon. what did this sort of quite sinister fake news sort of war of propaganda between china and the united states tell you about the strengths and weaknesses of each country? >> the most remarkable thing, you have in the middle of a global pandemic what is virtually no international cooperation. you have

rumsfeld did not prosecute this i don't know but i would ensure you to have general franks testify. >> the question on afghanistan, if you look back on the experience and afghanistan, what do you think we accomplished and what opportunities were missed under what do you think are the main lessons learned from the intervention in afghanistan on nationbuilding, providing development assistance, on joint civil military operations. i pose that for whoever would like to take a shot at any of those pieces of the question. >> our longest term impact was through our support for education, particularly for female education. we have a generation that has grown up in a free immediate environment with the curriculum that is not dictated by an autocrat. you have again an entire generation in their 20's and maybe early 30's for whom the norm is an open society. we quit on them too soon for they were in a position to undertake major societal change. >> if i can weigh in on that, i think we used 20 years to accomplish a great deal in terms of making our country more safe. we have counterterrorism cap

. >> another question is your book talk about rumsfeld? >> and can i don't get to the 60s i love that story and everyone to learn about run through history. such an important part of california segregation. roxanne and her work examines the u.s. as a colonial nation for historical racism of white supremacy. how do you see that analysis? >> thank you so much for mentioning southern colonialism. write about the ways in which native americans were enslaved you should definitely check out the book about the frontier. this book is amazing. absolutely think we need to make those linkages because the sigh, imprisoned okay i think the linkages she shows there are so clear i thought the best book that shows you can't think about segregation white supremacy in the state not with, i can talk about chapter one absolutely an important part of the story. the way the taking land, the system gets set up for imprisoning, enslaving, and just the practice of setting up segregation which was originated before stated thanks for asking that. >> with the religio

he was so suspicious of the rumsfeld/cheney insole lens. he did grieve that mistake terribly, but having covered him as secretary of state and then america's promise initiative, in my most recent conversation with him, it was our discussion of the colin powell institute and what he was doing for first generation students and students of color who echoed his background, coming from the bronx and his role as the child of jamaican immigrants and how he talked about driving south from new york to visit alma when they were courting and having to, you know, carry your food and make sure you found a rest stop and remember the green book, avoiding anything during jim crow south where he would go south to alabama where he had first met her. he was a veteran of vietnam. came up through the ranks. also worked for cap weinberger, the former defense saer. and when he was omb director and then to captown of security adviser and served republican politics for decades. he was very suspicious of bill clinton as were all the joint chiefs. sam nunn, a fellow

>> you know, to paraphrase donald rumsfeld, you go into court with the laws you have and the sentencing rules you have and the charges people got for trespass, obstructing congress, and so on, those are the penalties they come with and if people want to change that, yes, then go to congress and make those more severe penalties. but it's not the justice department is being more lenient than they should be. that's just the penalties that come for those crimes. >> elliot williams, thank you very much. >>> coming upon up, vice president kamala harris's office on clean-up duty once again. why she is now making amends to israel. 'hook audrey sent. ♪ oh my land and sea, that's mine ♪ ♪ and pardon when i shine ♪ ♪ hands to the sky, all mine ♪ ♪ woah, woah no ceiling woah ♪ ♪ woah good feeling woah woah ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ up to one million dollars. that's how much university of phoenix is committing to create 400 scholarships this month alone. because we believe everybody deserves a chance. see what scholarships you may qualify for at phoenix.edu ♪ ♪ dignity. it demands that w