a lot of people are trying to source those tapes to liz cheney. do you want to disabuse anyone of that? >> liz cheney won't leak tapes and deny it. that's not who she is. one thing this chapter revealed and something the historian robert carroll said, power doesn't corrupt as much as it reveals. it doesn't reveal the best but says who we are. it revealed liz cheney to be a person of great courage and conviction. it revealed kevin mccarthy to be utterly craving and in fact, so many of the other members of his team like elise stefanik who when liz cheney said i'm not telling a big lie that eats at the heart of our democracy, e elise stefanik said i'll tell the lie if i can have her job. i think those attacks suggesting liz cheney was the source of this for an effort to tear her down when kevin mccarthy is being torn down by his own falsehoods. >> let me play one more thing. this is the person beyond donald trump kevin mccarthy works. marjorie taylor greene. here is another thing she did not recall this is calling speaker pelosi a traitor. take a lis

take liz cheney, for example -- >> you want to spend more time on this as well? >> i actually do. i generally want to understand this, i want to understand how you think about this. because liz cheney, who has the same view as you of january 6th, she said she doesn't want donald trump near the white house and she will work not to let that happen because she thinks there are some things more important than party loyalty. >> well, maybe you ought to be talking to liz cheney. >> no, but i'm not trying -- really, it is not a gotcha. i am trying to understand is there any threshold for you of what some of the people of normal level -- >> i say many things i'm sure people don't understand. >> senator mcconnell had no answer for the question, and good for you for staying with it. this is not unique to mitch mcconnell. people have written books in the last few months how bad donald trump has been for the party, how they can help to change the course. i'm thinking of bill barr that wrote a book about what actually happened, the lies around january 6th and then when asked would he support h

liz cheney's willing to do that. mitt romney's willing to do that, but they're not the leaders of the party, so if the leaders of the party, like mcconnell and mccarthy, aren't able to do it and they're just interested in themselves and their own power, then it's not america first. it's themselves first and america could be last in the realm of democracies. >> in service of donald trump. it is amazing. congressman eric swalwell, thank you so much for starting us off this hour. joining our conversation is jake sherman, founder of punchbowl news. also joining us, kimberly atkins stohr, senior columnist at the "boston globe" and the co-host of the #sistersinlaw podcast and charlie sykes is here, they are all msnbc contributors. so, jake, i wanted to ask you, you know, and you have been so blunt about the dynamics up on the hill and we call on you on the day that the republicans are against a medal of freedom for the law enforcement officials who protect every last one of them. we called on you in the days after january

quote, while i was rallying in wyoming against liz cheney, kevin mccarthy was defending liz cheney among house republicans. while liz cheney was secretly recording kevin mccarthy for the "new york times," gop leader, you should have trusted my instincts, not your own. as we said already, cheney has denied taping or leaking the audio to "the new york times." it's where we start the hour with our most favorite reporters and friends. luke broadwater is here, also joining us, democratic congresswoman madeline dean of pennsylvania. chuck rosenberg is back. luke broadwater, i start with you. this is from two of your colleagues. they sort of put out the ultimate tease in television. there are more tapes. tell me what you know about kevin mccarthy's private comments and their sort of widening gulf between his public posture. >> yeah, i mean, these audio tapes revealed by jonathan martin and alex burns have sent a bombshell through capitol hill today, and certainly on the republican side of the aisle. kevin mccarthy has spent the better part of the day calling people, trying to shore up support.

le pen and liz cheney both _ republican party. le pen and liz cheney both have _ republican party. le pen and liz cheney both have very _ republican party. le pen and liz cheney both have very political i cheney both have very political fathers. but i want to turn to one of their primary. doctor oz, lots of viewers will know her because he was a fixture with oprah winfrey. he's getting mr trump's endorsement. how do you see that one playing out. some opera fans were asking her to disassociate herself. she some opera fans were asking her to disassociate herself.— disassociate herself. she was the erson disassociate herself. she was the person who _ disassociate herself. she was the person who made _ disassociate herself. she was the person who made doctor- disassociate herself. she was the person who made doctor oz - disassociate herself. she was the person who made doctor oz who | disassociate herself. she was the i person who made doctor oz who he disassociate herself. she was the - person who made doctor oz who he is. we use that to elevate his career. then donald trump appeare

and the crazy thing is it was all done to protect liz cheney. at the time is protecting president trump from impeachment and kevin mccarthy was protecting liz cheney from criticism. and now she is owning them with their own words. and maybe liz cheney has done us a favor because now finally you don't have to be a lobbyist with a $5,000 check to know what kevin mccarthy and steve scalise really think. i was upfront about the fact that i was going to politically oppose liz cheney. i went to wyoming, i made my case there. this notionotion that you can he these sniveling calls and try to foment action against republicans by big td the doj is not fitting of leadership. >> tucker: that is exactly right. he can represent public and voters if you are associated with trumpet you cannot represent republican leaders if you are calling on big tech to censor voices who criticize you, and if you are accusing the people of criticizing you of committing an illegal act of violence as steve scalise just did. did he apologize for that? >> he said he was sorry for

that republican -- republican liz cheney who's been vilified by the republican party for seeking to hold drum accountable. kevin -- donald trump accountable. kevin mccarthy helped lead the crusade against her. he supported her losing her leadership role in the party and recently endorsed her primary challenger, despite the fact that he's espoused what appears to be the exact same views as liz cheney. except it was behind closed doors, of course. this comes on the heels of the reporting earlier week from "the new york times" that mccarthy vowed to drive donald trump out of politics, and that he would recommend donald trump resign from office. mccarthy has denied that reporting as totally false. but actually in a separate piece of audio, there's more than one tape also obtained of a phone call between mccarthy and his leadership team. he suggests those tapes suggest mccarthy wasn't telling the truth with his denial either. >> the only discussion i would have with him is that i think this will pass, and it will be my recommendation you should do that. >> you just heard kevin mccarthy tell l

folks like liz cheney wanting to go further, calling it a genocide. that's not where the rest of europe is. and rhetorically, strategically and also economically, they've tried to maintain this alliance and that's taken some time and that's led to the frustration of members of congress. >>> our reporters will be back with us on another subject in a few minutes. >>> ahead, we'll speak to the former president of ukraine. and that your new car ought to come with newfound happiness and zezero surprises. and all of us will stop at nothing to drive you happy. we'll drive you happy at carvana. bipolar depression. it made me feel trapped in a fog. this is art inspired by real stories of bipolar depreion. i just couldn't fi my way out of it. thlows of bipolar depression can take you to a dark place. tuda could make a real difference latuda was proven to sigficantly reduce bipolar depression symptoms and in clinical studies, had no substantial impact on weight. this is where i want to be. call your doctor about sudden behavior changes or suicidal thoughts. anti

and as a matter of fact, trying to run liz cheney out of the party. he is now supporting a challenger to liz cheney in wyoming in her race. he has made liz cheney a pariah, yet, sam, he completely agreed with her in real-time. >> not only that, there's a few little gems sprinkled on that recording. if you notice the first line, it revealed they had a separate conversation earlier in which they were talking about using the 25th amendment to get trump out. so that's now revealed. i would love to hear a recording of that phone call too if one exists. secondly, he talks about making sure mike pence doesn't retroactively pardon trump, which means he was thinking ahead to the possibility of trying to make sure that whatever punishment they gave to trump was permanent. so, you know, it is one thing to say, yeah, kevin mccarthy wanted to call donald trump and push him out of office. it is deeper than that. he was scheming of ways to do it, not just by having a phone call with him. of course, that's all passed now. within a couple of weeks he was at mar-a-lago

cheney from criticism and now she is owning them with their own words and maybe liz cheney has done us a favor because now finally you don't have to be a lobbyist with a five thousand dollar check to know what kevin mccarthy and steve scarless really think. you know, i was upfront about the fact that i was going to politically oppose liz cheney. i went to wyoming. i made my case there. this notion that you can have these sniveling calls, try to foment action against republicans by big tech and the doj is not fitting of leadership. well, that's exactly right. i mean, you can represent republican voters if you're personally annoyed with trump, okay, but you cannot represent a republican leaders if you're calling on big tech to censor voices who criticize you and if you're accusing people who criticize you of committing an illegal act of violence. steve scalise, you saw scalise today to apologize to you for that . he said it was he was sorry if it caused many problems. but what i said to steve scalise is that if you accuse someone of potentially breaking the law and by the way, he wasn

it begins, begins with liz cheney saying, we were talking about the 25th amendment resolution. so there is a giant story in there that we have yet to learn, which is what was kevin mccarthy saying about the 25th amendment and with whom and what was liz cheney saying. the shiny apparently was researching the 25th amendment process. and then it turns into a resign discussion, the discussion that kevin mccarthy denied. before, before he knew that you had a tape. that you were gonna play on television tonight. >> the 25th amendment thing, that is a very soup awe in. not only had they've been talking about the 25th minute but he was asking detailed questions about how it would be implemented at least according to the way the way the tape goes. thanks kevin, liz cheney says, there is a question when we were talking about a 25th amendment resolution. mccarthy says yeah. cheney says, and you asked. you know, what happens if it gets thereafter he's gone is there any chance are you hearing that he might resign so mccarthy and liz cheney and presumably others are having enough a detailed

liz cheney knows the truth about kevin mccarthy. i think there's a common thread about kevin mccarthy and mitch mcconnell. we often say donald trump will do this again. but the truth is the republican leadership, the republican party would let all of this happen again and they would play their role in ensuring it would all happen again. even in an environment where kevin loses his quest for the speakership for a second time, this is not a republican party in the house that would elevate somebody that is a consensus-healing figure. i don't know what happens if kevin loses the speakership because it throws the caucus in disarray. the likelihood of getting someone who will do even more bidding for donald trump, his authoritarian tendencies and willing to cover up the crimes january 6th and the ongoing crimes the republican party is willing to tolerate, the risk of somebody even greater than kevin mccarthy willing to play a role in that becomes much, much higher, mccarthy does not get the speakership. >> and it is this sort of vice that

but it is clear, many people share liz cheney's view. even if they don't say it publicly or have the courage to say it. >> it appears now they both said the quiet part out loud. it is just that mccarthy lied about saying it. former congressman charlie dent, thank you, sir. all across eastern ukraine, russia's unrelentless assault has ordinary civilians just fighting to find a place to hide. next we're going to take you to an underground bunker of sorts to meet some people who have been there hiding for weeks. nag. ok so they were trying to verify my employment status while i was at work, in a giant hole, in a mine. but then something amazing happppened. hello? carvana worked with my shift manager and got everything sorted out so i didn't miss out on the car. super helpful. i was over the moon, even though i was underground. we'll drive you happy at carvana. meet a future mom, a first-time mom and a seasoned pro. this mom's one step closer to their new mini-van! yeah, you'll get used to it. this mom's depositing money with tools on-hand.

republican congresswoman liz cheney was quick to push back. let's listen to all of this. >> i wasn't satisfied with what i heard. it is crucially important the united states be clear we are absolutely committed to zelenskyy's victory. we should not be talking about, as jake sullivan did just now, improving zelenskyy's position at the negotiating table. this is about defeating russian forces in ukraine. i think this clearly is genocide. >> you heard her come out and say this is genocide. but jake sullivan wouldn't say it. labeling doesn't matter. why stop short of calling this genocide? the administration has been forthright in calling what we're seeing war crimes, calling putin a war criminal. >> he's clearly a war criminal. that new general is clearly a war criminal. in my view, it is genocide. president putin has said many times, he's written as well as said, that ukraine doesn't exist. he is taking action to do that, to make ukraine not exist, to wipe ukraine off the map. that, pamela, is genocide. now there may be implications of that desi

instead of protecting liz cheney, who stood up with integrity, kevin mccarthy is supporting liz cheney's opponent in the republican primary. when you listen to kevin mccarthy, he was absolutely right about almost everything he said privately to his members, what has changed -- to suggest he should change his position. he had put america first for a couple hours and days after january 6th. now he is putting kevin first. he realizes he needs donald trump, if he ever wants to be speaker of the house. which means for america, donald trump essentially would be speaker of the house, if kevin mccarthy were ever to get that close to the capitol. >> does it make it a worse or better that they know? there's something reassuring about listening to them correctly respond to these things. even the response to the berry more tweet, where barry more, days after this is saying, well looks like a black cop shot a white lady. they are like, oh my god. that is like, there is something reassuring words like, yes, correct, i'm not crazy, you are not crazy. people watching this i'm crazy. that is the right re

and finally, congresswoman, liz cheney of wyoming. one of two republicans on the january six house elect committee. her vocal opposition to trump's big lie has led to threats, demotions from her own party, and a primary challenge. >> former president trump continues to make the same claims that he knows caused violence on january six. unfortunately, too many in my own party are embracing that former president. are looking the other way. our minimizing the danger. that's how democracies die. >> in a statement today, using a quote from kennedys 1961 inaugural address, cheney turn the attention back to the war on ukraine. and the long history of the world, only a few generations have been granted the role of defending freedom in its hour of maximum danger. today, we stand at another hour of maximum danger in the cause of freedom. president zelenskyy and the ukrainian people are teaching a new generation of americans what our founding fathers learned firsthand, absolute and uncompromising courage in the face of tyranny. to those award rec

i don't think liz cheney would do this. i frankly don't think a member would do this. but i think a staffer who was freaked out at the fear that was palpable in the house chamber when shots rang out and someone was killed right outside the doors to the house of representatives, i think the stuff that worked there were traumatized by that. and i think they have continued to be very upset behind the scenes over the failure of the republican party to be taken seriously. >> michael, is there a chance these leaks are actually stealing the january six committees thunder? and these are their because, it's gonna be a big hollow when it comes to public hearings >> know, i think quite the contrary. i think these leaks should be adding more fuel to their fire. i think these leaks should be clarified and what steps they are taking. not just for the january six commission, but also for the doj. i mean, stephanie, how much smoke those guns have to admit before there are consequences? i mean, we are tiptoeing around tonight, you know, the chairman of the committee, with all due respe

-- liz cheney and a number of aides. that is where these recordings came from and it appears that is where the call with donald trump came from as well. your thoughts on these tapes? caller: hello? host: hello. caller: hey, john. unfortunately, you get to be the guy that gets picked on by me this morning on the same topic i talked about last time i called in. it is find that you are covering this topic this morning, but i have to come again, ask -- to, again, ask, why is it that one year and a half later we still have not heard any audiotapes or seen any videos of hunter biden's laptop? that is a story, john. it really is a story and it was one that was neglected to your into africa. it is still being neglected by the powers that be including c-span. i wish she would get maranda on the program and let's have a real look at the hunter laptop story and the joe biden-hunter biden story. host: it came up yesterday when the attorney general was on capitol hill, bill hagerty of tennessee, who was asking about the hunter biden

again, this is january 10th, still siding with liz cheney. this is before he helped push liz cheney out of republican leadership and before he started campaigning for her opponent. does this suggest republican leadership knew the january 6th was wrong and that it spelled trouble for their party and for the country? >> clearly, clearly does, jake. there's no doubt about it. the language that kevin mccarthy uses, and by the way, the other republican leaders on that call use, including liz cheney who was a member of leadership at the time, steve scalise who is still in leadership. tom hemmer, they talk about donald trump's behavior as totally unacceptable. and they talk about the behavior of the far right in their own conference as truly, truly dangerous. and that's obviously not something that any of them, i guess other than cheney, would say in public. and she for her trouble is no longer a member of house republican leadership. and again, this is one of the central, central stories in our book, is how the republican party at least at the lead

i'll talk to liz cheney and former cia director david petraeus, next. >>> and refugee crisis. as millions flee the violence in ukraine, the world comes together to help. an ambitious new pledge for refugees. >>> new chief ursula von der leyen and hugh evans. plus, why they fight. across ukraine, reminders of old russian oppression are fueling today's fight. >> we understand the danger that may happen with this if putin continues. >> what ukrainians remember and how it's drooiving their fight. my special report from ukraine, ahead. >>> ukranians on the ground are bracing for more war. after the defeat in the battle of kyiv, russian president putin has brought in a new general to help, dvornikov. you can see it to the east of kyiv. it's a new prospect that even more brutality after the attack on bucha and the train station, which targeted 50 people trying to leave the region, including children, yesterday president zelenskyy met with u.k. prime minister boris johnson to help. prime minister johnson pledged more ukranian equipment for ukraine, including 800 next generation anti-t

nancy pelosi stepped in, took them away and put two trump hating types in there, liz cheney and the other guy. so, it's not going to be a fair trial, number one. number two, i watched barack obama just get finished talking. now, barack obama created black lives matter. when a reporter asked him two or three months before he was ready to retire from his second term, he said, aren't you afraid of the white people, what do you call them, fascists out there that might do you some harm? the president, he answered no. he said because as we speak, i am creating my own private army. no reporter asked him what the president of the united states meant by that strange remark. about a month after that, he went to an all black college -- host: we are going to move on to our next caller. donald, florida, republican, will the january 6 attack be a factor in your vote? go ahead. caller: yeah, a central factor in my vote. these people that say that wasn't nothing, 144 police officers stampede. we are hitting them over the head with the flag. they smashed their head, they cut fingers off. donald trump went

liz cheney sort of kept it up. you look at mccarthy and mcconnell where mcconnell has not spoken to donald trump since that day. mccarthy said critical things about president trump after january 6 paid when he realized the base did not react that way, he comes back into the trump column. mcconnell basically decided not to yell as loudly and be as critical as he was. liz cheney showed the acorn does not fall for far from the tree. she is not going to run from a fight. you can agree or disagree with her, but she is just like her dad. host: quickly, democrats or republicans take the senate? guest: i think both the house and senate are going republican. what ought to scare the heck out of democrats is let's say republicans have a 52-48 majority, you go into 2024, there are 23 democratic seats up, 10 republican seats. what is worse for democrats is there are seven democratic senate seats up in states donald trump carried in 2016 or 2020. there is not a single republican seat up that hillary clinton or joe biden carried.

liz cheney sort of kept it up. you look at mccarthy and mcconnell where mcconnell has not spoken to donald trump since that day. mccarthy said critical things about president trump after january 6 paid when he realized the base did not react that way, he comes back into the trump column. mcconnell basically decided not to yell as loudly and be as critical as he was. liz cheney showed the acorn does not fall for far from the tree. she is not going to run from a fight. you can agree or disagree with her, but she is just like her dad. host: quickly, democrats or republicans take the senate? guest: i think both the house and senate are going republican. what ought to scare the heck out of democrats is let's say republicans have a 52-48 majority, you go into 2024, there are 23 democratic seats up, 10 republican seats. what is worse for democrats is there are seven democratic senate seats up in states donald trump carried in 2016 or 2020. there is not a single republican seat up that hillary clinton or joe biden carried.

. >>> and plus liz cheney says there is enough evidence to refer former president donald trump for criminal charges. new details from the house panel investigating the january 6th insurrection. >>> and on his 100th day in office, new york city mayor eric adams tests positive for covid. it comes amid a surge of new cases in new york and washington, d.c. we'll ask a health expert whether other big cities are next. >>> good morning. and welcome to "way too early." on this monday, april 11th. i'm jonathan lemire. british prime minister boris johnson made a surprise visit to kyiv over the weekend, for a remarkable showing of unity with ukrainian president zelenskyy. the two leaders walked side by side, through ukraine's capital on saturday, which just a few weeks ago was under threat from russian forces. stopping to talk with citizens on the street, johnson's visit came one day after he announced that britd wouldn't provide an additional $130 million worth of weapons for ukraine. following the tour, they came together for a press conference where they had this to say. >> over the past few hours,

you are an old country club republican, you and this cheney. -- liz cheney. i am a vietnam veteran. i am a republican, but you are a go along, get along and have been through most of my life. you give into the democrats. you are past history. you could not win your district now because people in red states do not like country club republicans such as yourself. we think that this country has gone too far to the left. almost every word we have had recently, a democrat has been the president. -- almost every war that tells you something. you get along with these people -- host: are you a supporter of trump? caller: i m because he would take care of the border problem and would stand up for america and not being one of these new world order individuals. host: let us look at those two issues, the border and standing up for america. was president trump successful? guest: he did a lot of good things on the border. there are a lot of liberals that do not think we should have a border. that is wrong. bush tried to propose, hence of immigration reform that would have stopped illegal immigrati

liz cheney rejects report of dispute on january 6 committee on criminal referral from trump. she said there is not a dispute on whether a criminal referral is valid. a little bit more news. let's hear from gwen in birmingham, alabama. birmingham -- republican -- democratic line. caller: i don't understand how the republicans can have such a large lead going into midterms. i am concerned about my rights as a voter. my rights as a lot of things. rights that they have against women. i am against all of that. i am against clarence thomas wife uniting with the january 6 people. i notice a lot of white people, i am sorry, saying january 6, that was an insurrection. the government was trying to be overthrown. that is democracy in america. we fought to be in this country. we fought for our rights and freedom in america. we hold america to be sacred and you are going to make a statement that it doesn't matter. yes it does. i am from alabama. we are the most racist state in the united states of america. i live in birmingham, the heart of alabama. even our governor ask these two men abo

i wish more republican leaders would be like liz cheney and defend the republican party. we could have differences. liz cheney and i disagree greatly on the pentagon budget but i respect the fact that she is willing to fight for the country over her political party. until we get more people in this modern party to do that, that is the reality. infrastructure, the fact that that was not a unanimous vote after we all talked about it for years, they did not want to give joe biden the victory. joe biden got a big victory and he got something done for the american people. that's it have been -- that should have been celebrated by everyone. host: a republican. caller: i was wondering on strategic oil, when you pull that out, how much was it when you put it in and how much is it going to cost when you put it back? isn't that just kicking the ball down the road? as far as stimulus checks go, he is one of the largest state tax on gasoline. he wants to take your gas tax and have somebody process it and give it back to him and write checks and give it back to the people. how much se

. >>> republican representative liz cheney says the democrat-led january 6th panel reports they have enough evidence to refer former president trump for criminal charges. >>> new details surrounding that massive home depot inferno in california >>> tiger woods' personal victory in augusta and a 25-year-old world number one takes his first green jacket a busy monday ahead. "early today" starts right now >> good morning and thanks for waking up with us, i'm vinita nair. >> i'm frances riff ver have a. >>> russia's war in ukraine enters day 47. president zelenskyy is again calling for tougher sanctions on russia, repeating his plea for a complete embargo on russian oil and gas. he also accused russia of cowardliness, saying its military is lying with its claims they did not hit a single civilian target. we turn to nbc's russ sanchez live in ukraine. we're learning of more evidence of russian war crimes against ukrainians >> reporter: frances, that's right. in kyiv, there's a feeling of lightness on the streets, kind of an air of victory after russian troops were forced to withdraw in th

cheney. here's where the party leaders were saying. >> okay, what did gaetz say? >> you high, yeah gaetz, said the gaetz brought up liz specifically, i just saw that on twitter. >> and someone just sent it, gonzales to send it to me, so i'm calling gaetz, i'm explained to him. i don't really have that much some other people call to see. the nature of what's, if i'm getting another one from the fbi tomorrow, this is serious -- to cut this out. yeah, that's potentially legal. >> potentially illegal. that right there is the part that gaetz and his posse are fired up about. msnbc reports freshman congressman marjorie taylor greene fired up. she's calling for both mccarthy and scalise to apologize. scalise, the congressman who was shot on a softball field back in 2017, did meet one-on-one with gaetz after this morning's gop meeting. then he tried to explain what he said in those recorded comments. >> there were some things that were being told to a number of us that were in that call about threats

but take liz cheney for example. >> you want to spend some more time on this? >> i actual will do. i really want to understand this. i really want to understand how you think about this. liz cheney who has the same viewers of january 6 said she doesn't want donald trump anywhere near the white house and she is going to work to make that happen because she thinks there are some things more important than party loyalty. >> well, maybe you ought to be talking to liz cheney. >> i'm not trying to -- it's not a gotcha. i'm actually trying to understand is there any threshold for you of on the moral level? >> i say many things i'm sure people don't understand. >> jonathan swan with axios did a good job there joining me john avlon, the author of the new book "lincoln and the fight for peace." also with us host of pbs firing line margaret hoover. great to have you guys back. it's been a while. thank you so much for joining us. >> good to see you. >> yeah, great to see you. >> margaret, let me start with you first. mcconnell did his best to avoid answering that question. what did you think o

joining me is liz cheney, member of the house services committee. congresswoman, thanks for joining us. you just heard my conversation with national security adviser jake sullivan. were you satisfied with what you heard? what might you be doing differently? >> thanks for having me. no, i wasn't satisfied with what i heard. i think it's crucially important that the united states be clear that we are absolutely committed to zelenskyy's victory. we should not be talking about, as jake sullivan did just now, improving zelenskyy's position at the negotiating table. this is about defeating russian forces in ukraine. it's about much more than ukraine. we've got to be moving much faster, much more quickly, recognizing that the ukrainians now, given what they've been able to do and how long they've been able to fight and what they've been able to inflict upon the russian forces, they need advanced weaponry. we need to be thinking about providing them with tanks, with artillery, with armored vehicles. we need to be doing much more and more quickly. there shou

quote, he said he was placating liz cheney, that it was fake. that he was just paying her lip service. quote, trump isn't mad. he has other things on his mind. he accepts kevin for who he is. it's not like he really trusts him. many republicans, quote, will be watching and waiting for signals -- i don't know if they missed the word smoke or not -- but for some kind of signal from mar-a-lago that could decide mccarthy's fate. bill, does that sound right to you? have they ever picked a speaker or house leader like that before? is it pathetic? >> it is pathetic. and this gets back to the point made earlier. it's important that congress act as a check on the executive and hold the executive accountable for misdeeds and make its own decisions, also about its leadership. and we already have members of congress today saying he insulted donald trump. he shouldn't be our leader. >> final thought, melissa? >> i mean, this is tote yims at its worst. i mean, again, kevin mccarthy is supposed to be the leader or wants to be the leader of the house republican

all i could think is fantastic new reporting is the smears and the threats that liz cheney faces every single day at the feet of mccarthy and mcconnell. they just don't have the -- i don't know what body part can i say on tv? spine to say it. >> no. they had a spasm of conscience. there's no riddle puzzle or enigma here that kevin mccarthy and mitch mcconnell knew what the right thing to do was and they refused it to do it. you are right as the profiles in cowardice but you see that they put above what they do above the right thing to protect the constitution. mitch mcconnell understood that this is not impeachable i don't know what is and yet when he had the choice between doing his job, doing his duty, upholding the oath and taking the steps he thought he needed to do to protect his power he probably very easily decided that i'm going to go with power so yes. you have capitulation. you have a deep, deep cynicism, as well. >> harry litman, at the center of the january 6th committee's work is not just an investigation as to how it happened but making sure it doesn't happen on -- in 202

first, that was stunning to me because at the same time we were seeing liz cheney. cheney and mitch mcconnell view january 6th the same way. they thought it was terrorism. they were as appalled by it and they blamed donald trump equally for it. they both, i believe, would like donald trump to disappear from national politics. they reached separate conclusions. her conclusion was i'm going to commit my career to taking on donald trump even if it costs me my seat. i don't want him near the oval office. mitch mcconnell's conclusion was loyalty to the republican party. if donald trump is the nominee, i will support him regardless of the fact i said he is responsible for a violent insurrection. >> tim, i want to know what you think. >> i want to, if you don't mind, step back and explain mitch mcconnell. throughout all of history, anybody in politics has to balance their values and moral believes with what they believe is expedient. at times people do what is expedient and morally correct. look at harry reid. when he lied about mitt romney's tax returns, he wasn't thinkin

cheney wanted to be kicked out. the first time she made the statements she made she was re-elected to her leadership position. it's only when she continued after that, that looked like somebody who wanted to make a point and wanted to be kicked out. >> she says the point she's making is to defend the constitution of the united states. >> jon, look, whatever it is, it wasn't like she was looking to protect her position and the first time that republicans inside that caucus had a chance to vote on liz cheney they voted to keep her overwhelmingly. >> since we moved to january 6th, i want to ask about the interview donald trump gave to "the washington post" where he said this about -- remember he said in the speech he wanted to, you know, let's march to the capitol. he said the secret service said i couldn't go. i would have gone there in a minute. i mean, rick, let's just take a minute here. this was the march that culminated in the attack on the capitol and he said he wished he was there. he would have gone in a minut

we have our leader that's basically negotiating with liz cheney on whether or not he should encourage president trump to resign or not is a huge issue pore me. >> this episode demonstrates mccarthy has a problem with the truth. >> it's a five-point playbook. number one, lie. number two, lie. number three, lie. number four, lie. number five, lie again. >> and mccarthy critics like republican congressman adam kingzer -- >> he continues to defend a narrative that is false and people pushing false narratives and that's wrong. >> mccarthy's words could be of of benefit to the committee that is considering to issue a subpoena for kevin mccarthy meanwhile their investigation continues to expand. cnn can report that rudy guiliani former mayor of new york city is expected to meet with the committee some time next month. ryan nobles, cnn on capitol hill. >>> and ron brown steen is a cnn senior political analyst and editor at "the atlantic" joining us now good to have you with us. >> thanks. >> so g.o.p. house leader kevin mccarthy under fire for criticizing former president trump and matt gaetz

he's called out liz cheney by name and a whole host of republicans by name. i'm not sure that would rise to the level of illegality. i'm not sure what mccarthy and scalise were talking about. i think they're talking about that general phenomenon as calling people out and urging constituents to do something. i'm not sure what he was urging them do. >> matt gates said representative mccarthy and representative scalise held views about president trump and me and they shared on sniveling calls with liz cheney, not us. what's your understanding for the appetite of the january 6th committee to have mccarthy speak to them? >> what bennie thompson told us i think he probably toldyou guys the same thing is he's going to issue another request to have mccarthy come to the committee and testify. they already issued one letter asking him to testify. mccarthy suggested he won't do so. the next step is a subpoena. will the january 6th committee subpoena them for a whole host of issues but mainly what they were doing on january 6th, what they knew, what they thought. time is

we have heard from two of the other people who were on that call, congresswoman liz cheney and a few minutes ago, steve scalise's office. first, steve scalise who said in a statement, "the only thing that democrats media continues to obsess over is january 6th." he's on working with his colleagues to stop the radical agenda and this is the important part. neither he or anyone on his team recorded or leaked private conversations among members. that's the parlor game that's happening here in the halls of washington. where did these recordings come from? congresswoman cheney's office knocking down the idea that she was the leaker in their statement. they point out this select committee asked mccarthy to speak with us about these events but he so far declined and representative cheney did not record or leak the tape or did not know how the reporters got it. that's the parlor game we are going to play here. then, there is also the national game of how this plays out and the person at the center of that is former president trump holding a rally in ohio. he's not shy away from speaking to t

cheney and steve scalise deny leaking the video another person close to trump says unless something else drops, trump will not likely ditch mccarthy for another member to be speaker carl >> shomari, thanks. >>> russia is revealing a much larger and bicker goal for the invasion of ukraine. they want to gain control of southern ukraine and eastern ukraine all the way to maldova he had been scaling back and refocusing on the east ukraine's defense ministry is calling this new plan imperialism. moscow is admitting this was a land grab all the way along instead of a war against mythic call nazis another mass grave has been discovered in a nearby village satellite images appear to show the excavation this comes after putin declared victory in the besieged city we're reporting in the city of western ukraine. you have reaction from president zelenskyy tonight. >> reporter: good evening, carl. in his nightly video address president zelenskyy saying the plans to get to maldova are the same as day one. this is about russia trying to expand its territorial boundaries by crushing the sovereignty

you got adam kinzinger and liz cheney. it's not like the leader in thoo. >> the list goes down the line here of otherwise respected individuals and they're not coming to the defense of the lacks a many there are literally just seven house republicans perceived as opposition forces here. he's backed primary challengers against them. just seven. republicans have stepped outside of the lines in dropped that's a very small number of institutional republicans who are supposed to stand on the line for each other. >> liz cheney is one of the recipients of the profile in courage because he is such app outlier and has stood up with pretty much no support from her own party. still to come, we're going to head to pennsylvania as democrats try to seize an opportunity to pick up a senate seat in a very difficult mid-term environment. you're watching "meet the press daily." watching "meet the pres daily. ♪ walking on ♪ ♪ walking on the moon ♪ ♪ some ♪ ♪ may say ♪ ♪ i'm wishing my days away ♪ ♪ no way ♪ ♪ walkin

that's what liz cheney said yesterday. the vice chair. she said something on cnn's state of the union. thank you very much, congressman. thanks for all your important work. we appreciate it very much. >> anytime, wolf. thanks. >>> coming up, a russian general known as the butcher of syria is now taking over putin's invasion of ukraine. we'll have a closer look at the m man. stay witith us. you're in "the situation room." '. in green energy. and also each other. digital tools so i impressive, you just can't stop. what wouldld you like the power to do? i booked our hotel on kayak. it's flexible if we need to cancel. cancel. i haven't left the house in years. nothing will stop me from vacation. no canceling. (laughs) flexible cancellation. kayak. search one and done. carvana's had a lot of firsts. 100 percent online car buying, car vendinding machines, and now putting you in control of your financing. at carvana, get personalized terms, browse for cars that fit your budget, then customize your downpayment and monthly payment. and these aren'

. >> now, so far congress member liz cheney and steve scalise have denied leaking this audio. how is this going to play out in the caucus, you think? >> i think that's the most interesting question here. trump and mccarthy have sort of a topsy turvy relationship but always in one direction, with mr. mccarthy trying to satisfy mr. trump. when i interviewed the former president last year about this, he was very aware of the power he has over elected republicans, including mr. mccarthy because so many of their own voters care about the relationship that trump has with elected republicans in congress. and it's so important to keep mr. trump satisfied because of that. so i don't think the issue here is necessarily will this impact trump and trump's relaugsship with mccarthy or vice versa. will trump look for another candidate for speaker of the house if the republicans win the majority in november because of this. i think he likes the relationship where mr. mccarthy is always trying to satisfy and keep trump assuaged from doing things that would be counterproductive to republicans'

congresswoman liz cheney says the january 6th committee has enough evidence to refer donald trump for criminal charges. >>> meanwhile, another key figure in the insurrection is cooperating with the feds plus, a major city is reimposing an indoor mask mandate. should we be concerned about the rise of cases? d anthony fauci joins me. >>> you might have read about the woman charged with murder over an abortion. those charges have been dismissed but don't be fooled, this is the future republicans are writing into law. "the reidout" continues after this. reidout" continues after this when it comes to cybersecurity, the biggest threats don't always strike the biggest targets. so help safeguard your small business with comcast business securityedge™. it's advanced security that continuously scans for threats and helps protect every connected device. on the largest, fastest, reliable network with speeds up to 10 gigs to the most small businesses. so you can be ready for what's next. get started with internet and voice for $64.99 a month. and ask how to add securityedge™. or, ask how to ge